Racking gates In or Out? Has this question finally been answered?

I know! I know! it's been discussed to ad nauseam, but this is a fun quick video that I just had to post. While on a climbing trip in Squamish this summer, my climbing partners and I had been discussing and or arguing the merits of gates in or out racking for a few days when finally while on a belay ledge, two pitches up "Rock On" we had a duel. Admittedly Kingsley with the gates out won the draw but he also got the drop on Colin gates in guy, who also seemed a little nervous. Anyone else up for a duel? Kingsley claims to be fastest in the west with his gates out technique.

https://youtu.be/sUCEZN2AXZ0

They both seemed pretty slow to me. But it isn't even remotely clear whether the speed of acquisition in the video is solely a function of gate orientation.

In terms of natural hand position, gates in on the front loops and gates out on the rear loops makes the most sense. This is even more so if you have to reach across your body for something, i.e. get a piece on a left loop with the right hand.

I will agree with rgold on this. I believe in this orientation (in on the front loops and out on the back) it allows for a more natural movement. I'm more concerned with unclipping from my harness than clipping to it..

I am gates in all the way.

I could see this being done in a quantifiable test of X draws or cams moved off, then back on.

The Gate Off!

Let's call it a rack consisting of 6 cams per shoulder sling and 6 draws per front gear loop, both sides, for a total of 12 cams and 12 draws. Gear must be moved off the sling/loop to a horizontal rope, clipped so you can handle the next piece, then sequentially re-racked on your shoulder slings and gear loops.

Go!

Faulted Geologist wrote:I could see this being done in a quantifiable test

You big nerd. :)

Honestly, I tried this way, that way, and the other which way, but finally just felt more comfortable with the way rgold described. I think some, no matter what the most efficient way is, will do what they feel comfortable with.

To each their own.

BigFeet wrote: You big nerd. :)

Geek. Not a nerd. Well, this is possibly a matter of opinion.

My close friends might say I am a Freek.

It will be a few days before I can weigh in with my test of skill. Until then...

The shape/size of the gear loop can be a factor.

Your all have too much time on your hands :)

Gate out, less chances of gates getting snagged on clothing and unclipping from gear loop.

I like the idea of gates out on the back loops and in on the front loops. The reason my friend Kingsley does gates out is because he likes to insert his thump into the loop on the cam and then unclip the biner that way he is ready to place the cam without readjusting it in his hand. I tried it and I liked the method but felt it took more concentration which can be hard when your run out and nervously grabbing your next piece of gear. I suppose either way with practice becomes comfortable. I posted the video because it was funny, keep in mind this was a very spontaneous duel high up on a ledge and we only did it once, but I'm going to be practicing my quick draw just in case I'm ever challenged to a duel:)

Gates out for Harambe

I always do gates out on my harness and gates in on my shoulder sling.

I used to be gates out but now I'm gates in. I thought there was a gear guy mail regarding this topic but I can't find it right now.

nate post wrote:I know! I know! it's been discussed to ad nauseam, but this is a fun quick video that I just had to post. While on a climbing trip in Squamish this summer, my climbing partners and I had been discussing and or arguing the merits of gates in or out racking for a few days when finally while on a belay ledge, two pitches up "Rock On" we had a duel. Admittedly Kingsley with the gates out won the draw but he also got the drop on Colin gates in guy, who also seemed a little nervous. Anyone else up for a duel? Kingsley claims to be fastest in the west with his gates out technique. youtu.be/sUCEZN2AXZ0

It's all personal preference, there is no right answer. Personally gates out is more natural for me so that's what I do. The only time that gates out is not quite as convenient is when reaching across your body as Rgold mentioned, but gates out works better when reaching behind your body to the other side which is how I usually end up reaching for gear on the other side of my body anyway.

Nick Sweeney wrote:Gates out for Harambe

Not all heroes wear capes.

Luc wrote:Gate out, less chances of gates getting snagged on clothing and unclipping from gear loop.

Good point. I've always been gates in, but have contemplated going gates out after being burned with a couple of clothes snags that lead to drops recently.

The gates in guy spent all his time grabbing the cam before he even toughed the biner. I am thinking about switching to gates out just so I don't accidentally get associated with this guy.

Back in the day, when it was a fad for white water kayakers to carry lockers on their PFDs for the eventual rescue a funny incident occurred. Dude was sporting two lockers, both gates out. He was having a shitload fun cartwheeling in a hole, when, out of nowhere (not really), comes a raft and drops onto him. No biggie, this is just more fun, right? Well, it was all fun and wet games till one his lockers clipped into raft's perimeter lines.
He survived, and started carrying his carabiners gates in.

amarius wrote:Back in the day, when it was a fad for white water kayakers to carry lockers on their PFDs for the eventual rescue a funny incident occurred. Dude was sporting two lockers, both gates out. He was having a shitload fun cartwheeling in a hole, when, out of nowhere (not really), comes a raft and drops onto him. No biggie, this is just more fun, right? Well, it was all fun and wet games till one his lockers clipped into raft's perimeter lines. He survived, and started carrying his carabiners gates in.

Haha! if I ever become a kyaker, I will remember this. Until then I'm not to worried about a raft dropping in on me while climbing. I have had a cam unclip from my harness while hip scumming up a corner because it was gate out, but I don't know how common this is.

Matt Himmelstein wrote:The gates in guy spent all his time grabbing the cam before he even toughed the biner. I am thinking about switching to gates out just so I don't accidentally get associated with this guy.

You are right, but the reason for that is he was trying to put thumb in the cam loop before pulling it out which he wasn't familiar with because the goal was to have the cam in hand ready to place it. In that scenario Kingsley clearly won the draw. Had Colin unclipped the biner first, like he normally would, he still would have to transfer the cam to his hand to be ready to place the gear in a crack, so by trying to be quicker he fumbled with it. I believe I'm done with this thread for now. I'm going climbing and I bet no matter how I rack 'em I will probably fumble and drop cams all day because I'm going to be overthinking all this. lol

Exactly. There can be unclipping problems with gates in or gates out, so that particular issue doesn't support one approach over the other. But I don't get the clothing issue. All my clothing is tucked inside the harness; there's nothing to snag, and I've never had that problem.