yonah bolts

Does anyone know if the Army is responsible for the bolts on the lowers? I know they keep the main face in great shape and I recently witnessed one of the military contractors inspecting the bolts and cable line but the lowers are in pretty bad shape. Climbed 4 Bravo Sunday and nearly all the bolts where spinners. The guy next to me on 3 actually pulled a bolt clean out and the anchors on 3 are in real bad shape. Last time I climbed that route I finished on the next route just so I didnt have to be lowered off of those ancient things. If the army is not responsible who would be? Only asking because I would be interested in chipping in on the cost.

I assume the OP is not a developer, suggesting that a rando with no experience replaces bolts, especially with glue ins is a bad idea. Doing a good rebolting job is harder IMO than bolting a route, there's more involved with glue,ins, trying to reuse holes, etc. To the OP hopefully you find out who's in charge and can donate some money to new bolts, if you don't find out on here maybe you can contact the Southeast Climbers Coalition?

Yes definitely not a developer and zero intrest in doing of the work but i would be interested in helping with the hardware cost.

Frailer wrote: If anything, the place needs to be cleaned up. There is trash everywhere on the mountain.

I agree the mountain could definitely use some TLC (from climbers AND all the other people who hike it). Yonah may not be the best climbing location in the southeast, but it's still a great resource, particularly for teaching new people, and is worth keeping nice. Whether that means hauling out trash (yes, there's a lot of it at times), removing all signs of camping from the LZ (I've actually seen a pair of army blackhawks hover, toss fast ropes out, and then had to abort a landing because people had tents set up and refused to move), or replacing bolts.

If there's any interest in planning out a cleanup trail day, count me in. I have zero experience organizing such a thing, but would be willing to help out in the planning with someone else who knows what they're doing.

TL;DR does anyone want to go cleanup the mountain with me?

Give your money to Rad dog, not kidding
He posts here and I have personally used at least a dozen of his anchors that he personally payed for. He is a good guy and friend of mine. He is Also a good climber
Not sure if he takes specific replacement requests though.

I'd be down to organize a clean up day. You guys think we can get a decent turnout? O

I'll turn out for a clean up day! When were you thinking?

Count me in for a cleanup day. Depending on the date I know of at least one or two people I could bring.

Hi Guys. I've made the SCC aware of this thread.

Trailday/clean-up, we can help make that happen and provide lunch and some swag for volunteers. We'd need to discuss a couple dates for this so I can make a quick call to 5th Batt and confirm a date that isn't in conflict with one of their training evolutions.
I'm not on MP much at all, somebody mentioned this thread to me so I'm posting up. Its best to reach me via email alpstyle@comcast dot net
Anybody interested in helping organize or participate in a tralday/cleanup please email me. Once we can get a date set somebody will post up the info here here and there will be a notice on the SCC website.

Thanks!

Scott

I've spent enough time at yonah to be interested in a cleanup day. Keep us posted whoever is making this happen

Count me in for a cleanup day, I think Yonah is generally in pretty good trail shape.

Bolt/Anchor replacement has been in the planning stages for the main face at Currahee and a couple of specific bolts at Yonah thru the SCC.

Wasn't aware the Lowers was in that bad of shape. Sounds like it needs to get addressed pronto. Is it just the climbs 3 & 4 that are bad? You say a bolt on climb 3 just pulled completely out? If that's the case that climb should be red tagged or the hangers pulled.

I suspect that we the climbing community are responsible for those bolts at the Lowers these days. Especially if they are in that bad of shape. I won't be able to get up there for a couple of weeks. Maybe someone else could take a quick look?

Probably best to just organize something and do it ourselves as Scott proposes.

Let me know. I know a couple guys.

Mark O'Neal wrote:Count me in for a cleanup day, I think Yonah is generally in pretty good trail shape. Bolt/Anchor replacement has been in the planning stages for the main face at Currahee and a couple of specific bolts at Yonah thru the SCC. Wasn't aware the Lowers was in that bad of shape. Sounds like it needs to get addressed pronto. Is it just the climbs 3 & 4 that are bad? You say a bolt on climb 3 just pulled completely out? If that's the case that climb should be red tagged or the hangers pulled. I suspect that we the climbing community are responsible for those bolts at the Lowers these days. Especially if they are in that bad of shape. I won't be able to get up there for a couple of weeks. Maybe someone else could take a quick look?

I was on 4 and I would say every 2-3 bolts spinned. Some where in decent shape. 3 was where the bolt pulled out. If you are familar with the route you get about 15 ft up and get inside the big crack. I believe that is where he was at when the bolt pulled. Luckily he had not taken or fallen on it. From what I took the drag of clipping the next bolt pulled it clean out. I don't climb the lowers often to know the shape of the other routes. A few of the anchors could use some rings. I don't mind chipping in on cost or picking up a few quick links

Frailer wrote:If the army no longer uses the lowers to climb, are any bolts needed on any of the mentioned routes? Or, would they all protect very well on gear? If the army does still climb there, wouldn't it be their responsibility to rebolt since the bolts are for them and not for climbers? Why wait for a trail day to clean the place? Next time you go, throw a trash bag in with your gear and pick up on the hike down. Maybe, if others see you doing it, they might have a change of thought. It seems to be a standard almost everywhere you go that you'll be hiking out with more than you hiked in with.

Most of us do that but there is some graffiti that needs to be removed and trash. Nothing wrong with getting others involved and remember not every one is a trad climber. No one is asking to have gear routes bolted just asking to make bolted routes safe for every one.

A Yonah clean-up day has been set for Saturday March 5. Meeting at 9am at the main parking lot. Fernando at Unique Outfitters and Bluewater Ropes have both offered to provide some swag for volunteers. The SCC will provide snacks, beverages, and lunch.
For those planning to attend please confirm here facebook.com/events/1004215…

Thanks!

Scott

Hmmm, I may be able to pitch in.

Ezra - thanks for the kind words. Let's get out again soon.

Back on topic:

It'd be nice to know more about the Army's use of the lowers these days and that would make a big difference in what needs to be done regarding the bolts. I don't have a contact with them myself.

Obviously anything that's pure mank needs to be cleaned and patched. Personally I think there's only going to be a few bolts that really need replacing. If the Army was OK with it there'd be a whole lot of them that could be removed without making any of the routes un-necessarily run out.

I'll put that cleanup day on my calendar, hope to see ya'll out there.

I appreciate everyones input here as well as offers to pitch in and help "fix bolts" but I want to clarify a few things. The organized clean-up is to pick up and haul away litter. It is in no way an organized chop/patch/replace bolts day.
I also feel its necessary to point out that Yonah is a big part of Mountain Phase of Ranger School, and as such the Rangers do a variety of training evolutions up there.
Bolts in random spots, including bolts at waist level on the ground or a line of bolts every 2 feet may appear odd or unnecessary to recreational climbers but the Army is often times training techniques to move 100s of men up and down a mountainside in the dark wearing full kit. Thier movement may be over fixed ropes, or leading, or aiding, or a combination of all.
It would be a huge mistake to remove any bolts on any part of the mountain, whether it creates a runout or not.
Even approaching them asking if you can remove some of their bolts would likely send up a red flag. And like it or not they have priority up there and if their training ground gets impacted by climbers then access to that area would be in jeopardy.
This isn't a case of misguided climbers having done some poorly overbolted sport routes and somebody needs to fix it, this is a US Military training area and should be treated accordingly.
Im not a message board guy, and I probably posted 3x more than I had intended to but I did feel it was important to point out what a bad idea it is to remove bolts that some climbers may view as unnecessary.
If anybody has questions or comments feel free to contact me or attend the cleanup day on March 5, I will be there. Thanks

A couple different dynamics at work here.

The Lowers...pretty much belongs to the Rangers for better or for worse. Nothing you add or replace properly 1 for 1 could hurt...but if they show up and their A0 training ladders aren't there...that'd be bad news for our user group for sure.

That White Wall route that was mentioned could stand to have the first bolt moved...Rad Dawg and I have talked about doing this for awhile now. That would be a worthy project for somebody to tackle.

I know there has been some acitvity recently at The Boulder. I'm not sure if the Army uses it at all so somebody else will have to decide what to do there.

I pretty sure the SCC doesn't wanna go messin with the govt's stuff. Methinks they gots messes of their own that still need cleanin up elsewhere. That said...I hear they are always lookin for good area reps. If somebody wants to step up and take that on just let em know. I know Jody and MC have done their time and Yonah is certainly better for it. Probably time to pass the torch to some eager young folk.

FYI- We are in the process of getting permission to do one for one bolt replacement. They have always been accommodating in the past and I would expect the same this time around, but nothing will be done until 5th Batt and/or USFS signs off on the work.

And to follow up on what Paul mentioned- A dedicated rep for Yonah would be great. If anyone wants to step up please get in touch.
Thanks!

Scott Perkins wrote:FYI- We are in the process of getting permission to do one for one bolt replacement. They have always been accommodating in the past and I would expect the same this time around, but nothing will be done until 5th Batt and/or USFS signs off on the work. And to follow up on what Paul mentioned- A dedicated rep for Yonah would be great. If anyone wants to step up please get in touch. Thanks!

I spoke with Cody about this yesterday Scott