The Devils Lake top rope cluster Fu&k thread...

Doug S wrote:...My objective here is not to stir up shit, but merely to suggest that Darwin will have his way despite your best intentions.

Quote of the day!

BSheriden wrote: Nothing like old geezers wishing for things to be how they used to be. News flash its not 1950 anymore, time to adapt and grow up!

So to 'adapt' means to place shitty anchors like those shown and skip the safety rules that have worked? I don't get what you are trying to say, besides the constant age and experience bashing you enjoy. I say adapt', and grow up some.

I think the tittle of the thread is spot on. All this idealistic nonsense is making ME feel like an old geezer... There is no utopia man, and if you can't figure out how to set up a proper TR rig at Devils Lake, then tough cookies, you don't climb. It is after all, only slightly more difficult than counting to three. Maybe I am getting old, but this wishy wanty self righteous gym generation leaves me utterly baffled and disappointed sometimes. I'll tell you one thing, if you are going to make it in this game you had better be able to take care of yourself. No rules, no regulations, and no amount of fixed hardware is going to keep you safe and alive.

Chris treggE wrote:Some of us DL regulars actually enjoy building anchors. Since, you know, we might need that skill elsewhere. Preferences aside, the park won't allow bolts, so it's really kind of a moot discussion here.

Absolutely. It is a lost skill to many noob's, who look for double bolt anchors and use quick draws for everything.

JJ Schlick wrote:I think the tittle of the thread is spot on. All this idealistic nonsense is making ME feel like an old geezer... There is no utopia man, and if you can't figure out how to set up a proper TR rig at Devils Lake, then tough cookies, you don't climb. It is after all, only slightly more difficult than counting to three. Maybe I am getting old, but this wishy wanty self righteous gym generation leaves me utterly baffled and disappointed sometimes. I'll tell you one thing, if you are going to make it in this game you had better be able to take care of yourself. No rules, no regulations, and no amount of fixed hardware is going to keep you safe and alive.

Well said....no excuse for safety being ignored.

JJ Schlick wrote:I think the tittle of the thread is spot on. All this idealistic nonsense is making ME feel like an old geezer... There is no utopia man, and if you can't figure out how to set up a proper TR rig at Devils Lake, then tough cookies, you don't climb. It is after all, only slightly more difficult than counting to three. Maybe I am getting old, but this wishy wanty self righteous gym generation leaves me utterly baffled and disappointed sometimes. I'll tell you one thing, if you are going to make it in this game you had better be able to take care of yourself. No rules, no regulations, and no amount of fixed hardware is going to keep you safe and alive.

Well said. Building top rope anchors at the Lake is great preparation for climbing adventures elsewhere.

Andreis, learning the craft at the lake in a relatively safe and easy to access crag is a bonus to any climbers growth and competence in the sport. Setup a couple hundred anchors and you will be ready with a solution when you find a jacked fixed anchor at the top of pitch three on an 8 pitch climb in Red Rocks. You have a responsibility to advance your skills if for no other reason then self preservation not to mention the safety and well being of anyone you bring into the sport. I have heard your sentiments expressed a few times by climbers new to the lake and without exception they ended up retracting the position after a year or two of building their own anchors gaining confidence, competence and self reliance.

It should not be all about cranking as hard as you can in a safe environment. They have gyms for that. Our little crag has it's quirks and a long and interesting history. Honoring the place and it's past are part of the appreciation of a sport we are all privileged to participate in.

When will the tree killers admit they just want to keep the dumb ass gym climbers off their Cliff even if it means a few trees die prematurely?

Enough of this anchor building crapola, it takes about 8 hours to "master" anchor and if you forget easily u should stick to golf or tennis

The best quote about DL toprope anchors is from the route description from Acid Rock, a classic DL climb. See "protection" on this link:

mountainproject.com/v/acid-…

Nuff said.

FUCK!!!!

Thank you Chris;
"TR, if you can't set one, Tommy Boy will come and hit you on the head with a tack hammer because you are a retard"

Now if the next person doesn't post a picture, and just keeps this stupid thread going with words, I will not be happy and will have to resort to finding Tommy Boy...

Bam. No picture. Your move Jugs...your move.

Just left my house in search of Tommy....That's right Steve, I am headed over to Monona now.

Wait! When have you even been to the top of the bluff to witness this TR crap that everyone is not talking about? There aren't any boulders there!!!

Steve topropes? This is like hearing that Aaron Rogers plays flag football ....

Tommy Boy getting ready with the tack hammer

I just finished teaching a climbing instructors course and exam at DLSP. I have placed a lot of bolts and can agree that in some areas(North Shore, etc) that fixed anchors can and do preserve the finite cliff top soil which is essential for trees (etc) to live. However, (1) most of the clifftops at DL are purely stone/ no vegetation, (2) if speed/proficiency is one of the arguments for adding fixed anchors at DLSP(which will never happen) I had students building trad top rope anchors this weekend in 2:36 , thats, 2 min, 36 seconds.... Average time for all participants TR anchors were all under 10 min.
The ability to construct a strong and redundant traditional TR anchor is fundamental skill for all traditional rock climbers.

As soon we begin lowering our standards for our sport we begin to risk loosing the quality of the experience it provides us.

Have high standards, get appropriate training, be a positive reflection of our sport and the user group we represent.

We were waiting but you never showed!!!!! And the only time I ever walk the top of the East Bluff anymore is if I need to get from Flatiron to Bulbous! HAH!

JLP wrote:This is a joke. What happens at Devil's Lake isn't trad climbing.

He never said people are trad climbing at Devil's Lake. He said (and you quoted)

EB wrote:The ability to construct a strong and redundant traditional TR anchor is fundamental skill for all traditional rock climbers.

Which is 100% true. Have you ever met a trad climber that couldn't build an anchor?

^^ I have. Shits real. Scary out there ha

jon jugenheimer wrote:Taken Saturday on top of the East bluff. Yes, I did have a very nice conversation of the single piece of webbing to the "Master point" guy belaying his grandson on it...scary shit...

WTF!!!!! Sketch fest and a half.

JLP wrote: This is a joke. What happens at Devil's Lake isn't trad climbing. Top roping, rehearsing, dicking around with 100's of feet of tubular webbing over a 50 foot cliff - it's not trad climbing - not even close.

Well the use of topropes in traditional climbing has long been in use as part of that sport. Basic safety backup to first leads, etc. and for beginners learning moves. Sport climbers never saw the need to learn the anchor part, they just 'borrowed' the hangdog and repeated falls part of outdoor climbing once they've got all those bolts slapped in place all the way up their crackless routes. Their use of toprope is only for a second or less skilled climber to run up the route off a couple of bolted draws at the top chain anchors.

Woodchuck ATC wrote: Well the use of topropes in traditional climbing has long been in use as part of that sport. Basic safety backup to first leads, etc. and for beginners learning moves. Sport climbers never saw the need to learn the anchor part, they just 'borrowed' the hangdog and repeated falls part of outdoor climbing once they've got all those bolts slapped in place all the way up their crackless routes. Their use of toprope is only for a second or less skilled climber to run up the route off a couple of bolted draws at the top chain anchors.

I love the romantic view of TR'ing a trad route and the utter disdain at TR with regards a Sport route... totally classic! Foot in mouth?

Here in CT, TR'ing is it's own beast, there are Traditional, Sport, and Top Rope routes.