Red Rocks - 04/30 - Helicopter Evacuation (Pine Creek Canyon: Challenger/Jet Stream Wall)

Hi Josh – Perhaps you or someone else can identify this area? Later today I'll post another photo of the area, zoomed-out.

Attached is a photo of the helicopter I mentioned in my original post. The helicopter circled through Pine Creek Canyon a few times, making a girl from another climbing partner wonder if it was for tourism or for rescue. It was cruising at a fairly low elevation. Then when it hovered above that large pink hogback and lowered people, we then wondered if it was rescue training. It left – perhaps went and re-fueled, and then returned; picking-up people off the hogback, and then zipped-off to the nearest parking lot where we saw the flashing lights of the waiting ambulance. We then assumed it was an accident. We all wondered what sort of accident occurred that caused people to be dropped-off/picked-up from that huge hogback so high-up that wall.

Helicopter rescue in Pine Creek Canyon, Red Rocks

Summer Time-
that is the Jet Stream Wall

Thanks, Darren in Vegas. So, Jet Stream Wall is above the pink ledge where the helicopters picked-up/dropped-off people?

Hogback in Pine Creek Canyon, Red Rocks

Yes Summer Time, that "hogsback" is immediately below the Jet Stream Wall. You can see the prominent arch of the Jet Stream Wall (shown in your first photo) here:

mountainproject.com/v/nevad…

Anyone know anything about the rescue up there?

Yep, I'm 100% an asshole toward someone who apparently facilitated someone's life threatening injury, no matter who they are or what they seem to do for the climbing community.

Imagine if I took a non-climbing friend to an ice crag, and I solo up some moderate ice to show her how ice tools and crampons work. Or maybe she's bouldered in a gym a few times, so now she's a "climber" who can take responsibility for her own actions. Now that she's seen me do it, I ask if she wants to try. I strap the crampons to her Rockports and hand her my tools. I let her solo up 20 feet and she falls off, hitting her bare head, splattering blood everywhere. I bear no responsibility? Hell yeah I'm responsible, even if I get underneath and try to catch her. I should've put her on a top rope as backup or told her to stay 3 feet off the ground or something, at least.

Yep right below Jet stream wall.
Could also be that, that is the only good pickup/ drop off spot for the Challenger wall(just down hill abit) as well.
I've seen tourism heli's fly below the canyon rim in pine creek a bunch. Which is illegal...get there tail number and report them if you see it. If we can't place bolts B/C of the wilderness, they sure as hell shouldn't be flying the canyons.
I'd really like to know what happened up there, anyone?

josh

There's a whole class of scam emails that are commonly referred to as Nigerian emails, because most of them originate from that country. They typically feature abnormal phrasings, linked words and mispelled ( =) ) words. Besides no talk of money opportunities, Rose's post reads exactly like one of those emails. If anyone is unfamiliar with those emails, I'm really sorry that you didn't understand the analogy. I'm just blown away with how incredibly insulting you guys think it is to be compared to a Nigerian.

Hi Josh – Today I called the Red Rock Canyon Visitor Center who, it turns-out, is not in-the-loop on rescues. (But I did learn their annual pass for $30, is a great value for those climbing in Red Rocks more than four days/year.) So the visitor center directed me to Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department Search and Rescue, who could share no information on the phone or had no information to share about their 04/30 rescue.

Perhaps Las Vegas SAR will post a report from 04/30, at some point, on their Web site:

lvmpdsar.blogspot.com/2011/…

LSMPDSAR typically does not post info on individual rescues unless there is a particular hazard or lesson they want to bring attention to. How many times could they post the same things; be prepared, 10 essentials, have the proper skills, don't drink alcohol etc. With the high amount of rescues done it would be a full time job just to keep the blog updated. They do rescues county wide not just at Redrock. Also they do training once a month and that could be what you observed.

John Wilder wrote:its actually pretty sad- LVSAR doesn't even call the BLM when they conduct a rescue in Red Rock- more often than not, the BLM finds out about on these forums, from what I hear. Which strikes me as insane- how can the BLM work to reduce accidents when they have no idea when one happens because the responding agency doesnt pick up the phone?

isn't the government great? Those are your tax dollars hard at work! lol

John Wilder wrote:how can the BLM work to reduce accidents when they have no idea when one happens because the responding agency doesnt pick up the phone?

We should be careful what we ask for. Do we really want the BLM working to reduce climbing accidents?

Jay

I'll leave my posts, but I apologize for any hurt feelings that I may have elicited. I would never have been so harsh in real life, and I'm an ass.

I originally wondered if it was SAR practice. But from the base of Brass Wall, we could spot at least one ambulance w/ flashing lights in the near-by parking lot. So after the helicopter retrieved people from that pink hogback (by hovering above it and dropping a line, though I don’t think a litter was lowered), it landed in that parking lot, where I assume a victim was handed-off to the waiting ambulance. So if it was indeed just training, I wouldn’t think the waiting emergency vehicles would have their lights on? And my climbing partner, who has sharper long-range eyesight than I, seemed to think more people were removed than lowered from that hogback. But if something indeed went wrong that day, I would’ve thought someone would’ve posted it by now and that a litter would’ve been involved in the rescue.

IMO LVSAR does a pretty good job at letting people know what's going on. Even when something that doesn't even relate to their job happens like this they take the trouble to inform us.

I think if we give it some time they will either get wind of this thread and let us know or they will post it up on their blog.

John Wilder wrote: its not just climbing accidents- its any accident LVSAR gets called out for...and depending on the scenario, i would absolutely want the land manager in the loop.

"In the loop" is one thing; "working to reduce climbing accidents," quite another. I, for one, want no government agency "working to reduce climbing accidents." If you want a taste of the BLM's idea of what it means to "help" the climbing community, just stop by New Jack City.

Jay

John Wilder wrote: Been climbing here 9 years and am pretty involved with the local community in alot of ways, and I've never once seen or read a detailed accident report from LVSAR, because I have no idea where I would find one. I'm not saying they are not doing a good job- on the contrary, I think LVSAR is doing a fantastic job, they're great at what they do and are excellent responders to an emergency situation in Red Rock. I just wish they would actively be more involved with the local community.

They do have a blog but don't post detailed reports: lvmpdsar.blogspot.com/

Remember, that besides some Metro employees, LVMPDSAR is an all voluntary team. It's a lot of personal time that they invest and I can understand why they wouldn't have time to be posting a lot of information. I'm guessing most of them do this in addition to a real 9 to 5 job.

I have seen a post of one member trying to get stolen gear back to the owner:

mountainproject.com/v/nevad…

I think it would be nice if they coordinated a bit with the BLM when they are on a rescue, but there has also been a lot of turnover withing the BLM, and although we have some great people in place, dealing with the BLM in the past may have not been easy.

Have you tried reaching out to any of the SAR people John?

Actually, I stand corrected, SAR does have a spot on their blog that reports recent rescues:

lvmpdsar.blogspot.com/2011/…

I hope I never have a situation where I can't get my own pathetic ass off the mountain, but thanks for SAR for all the hard work and training you do just in case!

Just spoke to SAR.

The rescue by jet stream was a couple of cliffed out hikers. No food, water or thermal pro and stuck.

Brian Abram wrote:Imagine if I took a non-climbing friend to an ice crag

Brian, would you feel the same if you knew that the truth in this case was that the girl who was injured was actually a MUCH BETTER climber than the girl who loaned her the gear? Just wondering.

Kristen Bridges wrote: Brian, would you feel the same if you knew that the truth in this case was that the girl who was injured was actually a MUCH BETTER climber than the girl who loaned her the gear? Just wondering.

What does being a much better climber have to do with it?