If you use a box or open end wrench with a very short handle, or hold it and apply force closer to the bolt to reduce leverage, that will reduce the chances you will overtorque the bolt.

A good friend and mountain guide in Francea 5.14 climber and prolific developer was climbing in an area last year were he did not equip the routes. He whipped and pulled 2 bolts consecutively and cracked the hangers right off the head on 2 bolts in a row. He broke his back, the doctors said probably no more climbing or skiing, Gave him the option to have a risky surgery that had a small % for success. He chose to rehab naturally. 1 year later climbing hard and skiing the goods again.

The verdict after checking the situation and the rest of the area of equipped bolts was that the bolts were over tightened and this caused the heads to shear off. It happens, and over tightening bolts is a problem.

OP. Honestly, if you think tightening bolts as tight as you can get them is safe, please stop bolting and leave it to the people with experience and knowledge. Your statement really bothers me because it shows a complete lack of understanding of how the bold works, and a very unsafe attitude to boot.
I don't want to offend you, but your method of bolting is unacceptable, unsafe, and frankly scary. Either get yourself a torque wrench and a understanding as to how bolts work, or stop. You are putting other people's lives at risk.

Could you tell us where and on what climbs you put these 400 bolts?

I don't want to be a jerk, but I find this really really scary. I have placed a ton of bolts, and tightening them as hard as you can will weaken the bolt with no outwardly visible signs. If you don't know how to place bolts pleeeeeease don't.

This topic is exactly why I think direct tension indicating washers should be more common. One design looks kind of like a lock washer, its kind of wavy, but is designed to squash flat at a certain amount of tension in the bolt. That way, just tighten the bolt until the washer is flat, and you know that the bolt is properly tensioned. The friction between the bolt and the nut are now unimportant. Also, they provide a good visual indicator of if an existing bolt is tight enough, because you can just look at the washer to see if its still flat.

Awesome idea Jesse.

What are those bolts called that the outer nut shears off at the specified torque so you can't overtorque it?

I've always used a torque wrench. Like someone else wrote - it's not that big of a deal to bring one along with all of the other stuff you need. I keep it on a six foot cord that hangs down from my harness. Just ask the company you buy the bolts from what the torque specs are (I usually buy from Fixe). If it's too much trouble to torque the bolts down properly, Petzl Long Life bolts (the kind with the pound-in pin) are a good option for hard rock.

where's the best place to buy hilti kb3?

If you're breaking bolts with a box wrench, WTF kind of cheap bolts are you using. Doesn't sound like the strength of grade 8 bolts, much less grade 5. And, "'Its also been my experience when breaking off bolts, that with a 2 foot breaker bar, its a major pain in the butt'"

And why would you be carrying a 2 foot breaker bar? And NOT a torque wrench.

How about this torque wrench,

buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=hand&item_ID=8824>>>

You can now catalog all the bolts you place, LOL......

And you gotta have this to make sure said torque wrench is calibrated correctly and accurately.

buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=hand&item_ID=7878>>>

LOL


Yeah, trad rocks!!!! Not to say I've never clipped a bolt, but I don't go out of my way looking for them. And yes, I know, trad has it's own hazards. That's why they have disclaimers on climbing publications. Remember, climbing is dangerous!!!!! If you're that worried, take up golf!!!! LOL

Juan

I've placed around a thousand bolts and since I'm not too strong and I use a small wrench I don't worry about overtightening. I did worry for a while whether I was getting them right but an engineer assured me that it would be pretty hard to overtighten them with such a small wrench.

People aren't using torque wrenches! We are all going to die! More Crap to f#@% with your mind. Zillions of bolts, no torque wrenches and I have never had or heard of a modern 3/8th carbon or stainless bolt breaking. Go climb, have fun, don't worry about it for a second! Oh yeah and don't crank on them til your eyes bulge.

Larry, sorry I meant diameter - sometimes brain function isn't so properly in the morning :)

Yeah - I think that you guys are really going overboard on this...bolts aren't going to fail because you over tighten them and none of my bolts are going to fail...no matter how hard I tighten them - the major concern of mine using stainless bolts is that they'll become spinners...which is a pain in the butt because I'll have to tighten them down again...or worse, a hanger will fall off...

I'm also really surprised how technically precise every seems to be commenting - placing a bolt is easy but not necessarily the best place to "make sure you 30 ft-lb force on the nut" - half the time I'm hanging upside-down in a roof reaching as far as I can with the wrench trying to tighten down the bolt...well maybe 10 percent of the time...I just wonder how many people actually are this precise with their bolt placement.

I'm pretty sure that the breaking strength on a bolt is so high, over torqued or not, that its not going to fail the steel of the bolt....Have you guys ever heard of a bolt breaking that wasn't a rusty spinner (at least in the stuff we put it in here) - I haven't...and there are some pretty scary old bolts here at the New River Gorge.

If you're worried about bolts being over tightened, then don't come to the new - you'd be safe off... :)

oh and the comment about the bolt breaking off when I hear a pop - I have broken off some 5 piecers (old bolts to be replaced) and then do in fact, break off down in the hole, but the wedge bolts always snap off right at the surface.

<3

-Dan

What is your favorite torque wrench?

Also, what is your recommended product to keep nuts from spinning in the future?