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is 5.8 really that much easier than 5.10
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Mar 2, 2012
I realize this sounds stupid but on several occasions and this is mostly in sport climbing I get on a route that is a 5.8 and there is one super comitting move where I am all WTF this is 5.8 right. Realizing that 5.10 is harder because it is usally more sustained blah blah blah but am I really weird or is this common.

I can't wait for the spray this is going to create. And yes I can lead 5.10 trad and sport on a semi consistent basis and have never fallen on a 5.8
martinharris
From Glenwood Springs CO
Joined Jul 20, 2010
231 points
Mar 2, 2012
Mt. Agassiz
Yes. Or, no. Maybe? Wait, what? Ryan Nevius
From The Range of Light
Joined Dec 29, 2010
782 points
Mar 2, 2012
25' drop...wheeeeee!
Since the rating system is totally subjective and everyone climbs differently there will absolutely be 5.8's that feel harder to you than some 5.10's. JesseT
From Portland, OR
Joined May 5, 2011
114 points
Mar 2, 2012
Colonel Mustard
If grade discrepancies disturb you, I would caution you to never take up trad climbing. Colonel Mustard
Joined Sep 13, 2005
1,382 points
Mar 2, 2012
At the BRC
If I choose my sequence properly, I can turn almost any 5.8 into a 5.12.
Mark
Mark E Dixon
From Sprezzatura, Someday
Joined Nov 29, 2007
200 points
Mar 2, 2012
Mark E Dixon wrote:
If I choose my sequence properly, I can turn almost any 5.8 into a 5.12. Mark



your route finding seems to be on par with mine.
ian watson
From Albuquerque, NM
Joined Apr 27, 2010
275 points
Mar 2, 2012
Clear Creek Canyon, Capitalist Crag
I'd say that yes, normally there is a big difference between the grades. However, just a few days ago I climbed a 5.7 that felt harder than a 5.9 that was literally 10 feet away. I think sometimes a certain type of move just feels hard for me because I don't get to practice it that often, so it can make the grade feel more difficult. Robert Buswold
From Longmont, CO
Joined Jul 5, 2010
55 points
Mar 2, 2012
OTL
and 5.9+ is harder than 5.11-



disclaimer: (not that I lead 11s or .9+)



oh and then there's the '5.5 awkward' or '5.7 polished'

not to mention 5.9OW



Okay, seriously now. When a 5.8 sport route feels too hard, I run it again on TR and it makes such a big difference. Leading is still very mental for me and a TR cushion allows you to find the 5.8 sequence you missed b/c you were freaking out on lead.
Matt N
From Santa Barbara, CA
Joined Oct 20, 2010
501 points
Mar 2, 2012
Chillin' at City of Rocks
Oh yeah.... for sure...... just hop on the Oomph slot in Boulder Canyon..... a classic 5.8

:-)
Princess Mia
From Vail
Joined May 22, 2006
427 points
Mar 2, 2012
Well if the difficulty of the moves is not the issue, but the commitment is, then yeah - 5.8 and 5.10 can feel nearly the same. Or if the 5.10 has no tricky committing moves, it can feel easier.

Been there.

Go do the "5.7" original finish to the Yellow Spur. 40 feet of unprotected balancy technical climbing with the crux move at the end just before you get some gear. That final move is probably only 5.8+, but I've literally done 5.11 moves that "felt" easier. Of course it's quite possible that I did the sequence wrong (twice).

GO
GabeO
From New Haven, CT
Joined May 13, 2006
336 points
Mar 2, 2012
Kilroy
Matt N wrote:
and 5.9+ is harder than 5.11- disclaimer: (not that I lead 11s or .9+)

marshalls madness. thats all i'll say hahaha

BE AFRAID OF THE +
Kilroywashere!
From Harrisonburg, Virginia
Joined Oct 27, 2009
287 points
Mar 2, 2012
Me and Spearhead
Just another thought:
A lot of the time when you're climbing well below your limit your brain doesn't treat it the same as when you knowingly jump on something at your on-sight level.
You don't get nearly as psyched up for the cruiser route because you "know" you'll hike it... then inevitably you'll hit a few moves that demand your attention and all of a sudden it feels much harder than it should for the grade.

I know a lot of times I climb with better footwork, make better decisions and use better tactics when I'm on something that's hard for me precisely because it demands my full concentration.
Brent Apgar
From Out of the Loop
Joined Oct 20, 2007
143 points
Mar 2, 2012
Rock Wars, RRG, 2008
5.8's and 9's at Devils Lake often climb like real-friction world 5.10's. Sandbagged for sure there alot. Woodchuck ATC
Joined Nov 29, 2007
3,091 points
Mar 2, 2012
Hippos kill people
if you have trouble telling the difference between 5.8 and 5.10 you should probably go hop on a 5.13, sounds like maybe you have superhuman strength and ability that has only been suppressed by societal norms of grades and other bullshit. germsauce
Joined Jun 14, 2010
66 points
Mar 2, 2012
Bucky
Old Custer wrote:
If grade discrepancies disturb you, I would caution you to never take up trad climbing.


Now that's funny. I agree though. What do you think, does 5.9 "wide" equal about 5.11d sport? Or maybe 5.9R slab equals about 5.12a sport? Seems about right eh?
J. Albers
From Colorado
Joined Jul 11, 2008
2,226 points
Mar 2, 2012
Great quality rock on this one!
I feel like you knew the answer to your question before you posted it Mark Mueller
From Flagstaff, AZ
Joined Nov 4, 2011
176 points
Mar 2, 2012
Adrift on the oceans.
You obviously onsite 5.11c.

The climbing scale is logarithmic, as someone pointed out long before me.

When you're nearing your limit, each letter represents a bigger and bigger gap in difficulty.

At grades far below your limit, it all blurs together.

So, what you really should have been saying was on the 5.10, feck, this feels like 5.8!

Of course, this is why so many moderate climbs at newer sport areas have funky grades.
SeaJellie
From Ann Arbor, MI
Joined Jun 5, 2008
9 points
Mar 2, 2012
5.8 is really that much easier than 5.10 S Denny
From Aspen, CO
Joined Sep 25, 2008
24 points
Mar 2, 2012
just Jong it!
It's actually two grades easier...but honestly...a lot of under 5.10 routes can be "easier"...but have one of those weird, funky, thrutchy, howthehelldoyouratethat? kinda moves. Tea
Joined Feb 10, 2006
444 points
Mar 3, 2012
Halarious
I figured that's what ppl would say
And I mostly trad climb and I feel that trad grades are generally more consistent than limestone sport.
But I think I am not good on limestone for the most part. However on that same note I agreenthat 1960 to say 1970 5.9+ is way harder than most moder 10b/c
martinharris
From Glenwood Springs CO
Joined Jul 20, 2010
231 points
Mar 3, 2012
And u r correct I already knew the answer but I didn't c a way this would turn into a dum ethics debate and I was curious if I was the only person that can insight 5.10 and the ocasional 11 and still get on a 5.8 and say WTF
Thus far I think I am not that odd cuz many ppl agree that it happens and it did not turn into an ethics debate so hell yes
Thread success
martinharris
From Glenwood Springs CO
Joined Jul 20, 2010
231 points
Mar 3, 2012
Finishing up Elusive Dream at the King Wall.  Adir...
There are three places in the united states where 5.8 is no joke...Index, the Adirondacks, and Joshua Tree...I'd also consider the Gunks, though climbing juggy roofs does not necessarily equate to sandbagged. Chris Duca
From Havertown, PA
Joined Dec 16, 2006
2,312 points
Mar 3, 2012
Rock Wars, RRG, 2008
Chris Duca wrote:
There are three places in the united states where 5.8 is no joke...Index, the Adirondacks, and Joshua Tree...I'd also consider the Gunks, though climbing juggy roofs does not necessarily equate to sandbagged.

Agree with the Gunks evaluation. Have often heard of those 5.11+ overhanging face climb sporties who are lost with a Gunks crack and roof climb.
Woodchuck ATC
Joined Nov 29, 2007
3,091 points
Mar 3, 2012
5.10b Crawdad Canyon, Veyo, UT
Old Custer wrote:
If grade discrepancies disturb you, I would caution you to never take up trad climbing.


hahaha, too true man, too true. I know what you're talking about, to me it seems like a mental thing, if you're clippin and rippin for eighty feet then you get to one committing 5.8ish move, its not really any harder than 5.8, it just seems harder because you just climbed eighty feet of really easy climbing.
iClimb5fun
From Santa Clara, UT
Joined Feb 12, 2012
10 points
Mar 3, 2012
Got Milk? How about forearm pump? Tony leads "...
martinharris wrote:
I can't wait for the spray this is going to create. And yes I can lead 5.10 trad and sport on a semi consistent basis and have never fallen on a 5.8

OK, so you can lead 5.10 "semi consistently," and have "never fallen on a 5.8," and you want to know if the grade is different? I think you answered your own question.
But there are hard 8's and easy 10's that confuse the issue. IE if you were climbing in Boulder Canyon and flashed all the 10b sport climbs put up since 2006, you might still find the 1970's consensus 5.8's a little difficult.
Tony B
From Around Boulder, CO
Joined Jan 1, 2001
23,667 points
Mar 3, 2012
offwidth .... bearbreeder
Joined Mar 1, 2009
2,153 points


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