I'm the gumby, the question's about banging iron, and specifically Z style stacking pins.

I'm a newby on big aid routes. For trade routes, how often do these get used? I hear a lot about Zees being used to get clean stacks happening, is this crap happening in the C3 range or am I ok without them til I get on something tougher?

I'd also appreciate any suggestions about where to find currently produced Zs+other stacking pins if someone knows.

Yeah, I'm a gumby, I know the flames are coming on, just got questions so thought I'd ask. Bout to man up my pin rack so I can get amongst but this is a grey area for me, don't want to get caught out and not have what I need for some beat-out pod that's probably C1 to Olevsky.

Zs are trick pieces - you will never need them on trade routes.

agreed.

The 'C' is C3 stands for clean.

+ 1000000000000000

C-3 STANDS FOR CLEAN

BTW if your a noob to aid what are looking at a C3 route for anyway .

May I suggest you spend that energy working on your gear and rope management skills first
and worry about stacking gear- bashing pins second.

the biggest beef I've ever had with noobs on a wall has been piss poor management skills .

Now if yer hearts set on some z's I've got a few extra original Leepers id part with.

good luck up there YER GUNNA DIE!

Grivel makes "Z,s"

I don't think you folk know what Killer is asking...

First off... Bigwallrog, My first aid wall was Lunar Ecstasy in Zion.
This was when it went from A3+ to C3+ (back in the day before i was all beat out...) Cool yer jets!

Second off.. You can place, and stack pins, without a hammer. This is clean aid folks.

Go for it Killer! If you are good with gear, you might be slow, but should have no trouble figuring things out. And Andrew is right, you probably won't need them on a trade route. (unless a topo said so.)

Happy Friday!