Flavor Savor 

Wow, sweet looking boulder and line-- nice work!

that looks sooo dope guys!

Nice work dudes!

Now that's one sexy boulder!

There's also a kind of low-ball lip traverse boulder a little further back that looked pretty cool, but we couldn't do.

Unfortunately the rock on this boulder is subpar, even for the Dodge. The arete is incredibly sandy and we broke off several footholds on the face.

Yeah Brian the boulder as a whole is super sandy. When we were finished cleaning the line it was all solid and I felt the moves were all four star. I guess I thought more traffic would do the problem some good as well, it's a bummer the rock isn't more solid. The whole crux at the top depends on how good and clean that top sloper feels.

I figured it would clean up too if we did some brushing and cleaning but the arete continued to feel very sandy. The top sloper felt horribly sandy which made it very hard to commit to those upper moves to say the least. Unfortunately we also broke off the key (for us) foot hold on the face that Vince is using in the middle picture.

It's too bad really because the movement is incredible: awesome arete moves to a very committing and difficult topout.

The work you guys did on the landing was greatly appreciated BTW. We took that header many times and it wasn't too bad. This is one problem you definitely don't want to try without a spotter to keep you from falling all the way down the hill.

I don't want to discourage people from checking it out for themselves, but I thought it would be helpful for people to know what to expect.

Helpful for those of us who have landed badly one too many times on aging ankle ligaments as well... From the initial pics loaded up it looks sweet but the landing was not apparent so thanks for the report.

Yea, it's sandstone. Brush it off, sack up, and send. The landing is safe and flat with enough pads, but tall!
This hasn't gotten that much traffic yet thus, I think it needs more work with a brush. The arete was never sandy for me, but that was because I was up there given her a good scrubbin'. It's like a good woman, you need to break her in!

Oh Yea! Went back today and sent! Temp was ~25F and it was PERFECT! Did a few minutes of scrubbing and this thing was A+! I used the same spot where the foothold broke and the grade stood firm.
Ignore the naysayers! This route is GREAT!

Very Nice! I'm more than happy to be proven wrong and it is good to see that you are back out climbing Rhoads.

Gracias. I was worried that you were right, but on that day I can honestly say it felt great. Is it bullet hard? No way, but I think that the footchips and handholds I used that day will stick for the long haul. Just stay off it when it's wet! This will probably feel extremely hard in higher temps.
Thank god that footchip is still good!

Whoa, wait a second Runnells. Did you send? Cause if not, I cordially ask that you rescind the one star until you do.

Since Rhoads is going to get all sensitive about it I'm going to give it one star and I haven't even tried it yet. :-)

I've been high enough on this thing to form an opinion. Since when do you have to send something to comment on its quality?

Hey Rhoads, I gotta side with Brian on this one. It's pretty commonplace on this site to add star ratings before a send. I can think of 4 or 5 off the top of my head that have the same thing.

While I haven't tried the line yet, I have looked at it and felt the initial holds. Sand came off of the start holds when I touched them and the top sloper looks way sandy. Oh well, so it's not a 4 star ultra mega classic. Who really cares? The line is fantastic but the quality just isn't there, it seems. If you weren't involved in the FA would you care as much as you do? Just curious.

And in the end, who really gives a crap, right? Everyone is complaining about a star rating on a scruffy V5 in the middle of nowhere, WI. Come on people. Calm down.

Absolutely, you can NOT comment on the quality of a route until you have sent. I thought that was common knowledge! How many times have you tried something, claimed it crap, then sent later and decided otherwise? I think we can all say we have.
I initially cleaned it yes, but I think people who know me would say that if in fact it was crap I would absolutely say so. I think those same people would say that if anybody does NOT give a shit about the FA its me.
What is wrong here is that the low rating keeps people off things that could be better with traffic. I think it felt sandy to you guys because you didn't properly clean it off.
In the end the rating doesn't matter but I have to ask: Is there no honor anymore?
Calmer than you are.......

I agree. Highly Executed at Backbone sucked for like 2 months after I cleaned it off. It was super gritty and dampish. Now after a bunch of traffic....nay, ton of traffic..... it is ultra-classic. I think with these super new routes at the dodge its not worth commenting on them until they have seen a lot of traffic. If this route never cleans off and stays super sandy, then maybe we can start talking about what a waste of time it is :)

The first snow is on the ground. So everybody is off rock and on the internet... I agree with Rhoads "sack up"

Right on Travis. Really, the route was perfect when I was on it the other day, not sandy at all. This little route deserves a chance! Won't you give it a chance? Little Flavor Savor is counting on you!
Seth Carlson is a god.

I guess I'm a little unsure why this is such a big deal (and required another thread about it elsewhere). MP is a forum for people to gather and share their information and opinions on climbs. Normally I don't give star ratings to things I haven't climbed, but in this case I felt it would be helpful for another opinion to be heard. If it is a great problem, one opinion on the internet is not going to keep people from getting on it.

And yes, the first snows are on the ground but the season is not over...yet.

Ha, no big deal Runnells, just rattling your box! The people will decide on the forum.
But seriously, this problem is GREAT! Probably not doable now with the snow. Until next year......

Mountain Project is a big tent, and can handle all kinds of opinions regarding routes. If you feel like you have enough knowledge to give a route a star rating, then go ahead and rate it. It's all about consensus anyway. Whether you send or not shouldn't matter, in my opinion.

I was working the low traverse to the right last weekend...it could use a little more cleaning, but after an initial scrubbing the holds weren't too sandy...my guess is it will go in the V8 range.

This thread I made deserves to be resurrected: www.mountainproject.com/v/if-you-dont-send-can-you-star-rate>>>

BTW, prime conditions for this route right now.