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First In Line Etiquette Question, aka Early Ice Season Shenanigans
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By Daniel Battin
From Green Mtn. Falls, CO
Oct 8, 2012
On Bridelveil
First In Line Etiquette Question
My partner and I went to climb Total Abandon this mourning. When we arrived at the Pikes Peak Highway gate at 8:50 there were already three car loads of climbers in front of us. We decided it would be a good idea to gear up then (before the gate opened at 9:00). We arrived at the parking area behind everyone else, but because we had our gear ready I was able to make a break for the Heros Traverse. I passed a couple of guys on their way to TA as well. Me and the climber who arrived about 20 seconds after me ro-sham-bode for who would get on it first (really cool guys by the way). I won and me and my partner got on it first, and everything went smooth. We linked pitches for expediency and tried to be gracious. When we got back to the car we found this note.

So Angry!
So Angry!


So the question is. When do you claim rights to the climb? If I got beat to a climb, in what ended up being basically a foot race, I would be disappointed but I would not be this upset. Thoughts?

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By Colonel Mustard
From Reno, NV
Oct 8, 2012
Colonel Mustard
My thoughts are it's too bad we get to see this non-issue played out on the internet. My prediction is we see the "angry" party on here soon and endless, pointless advice.

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By splitclimber
Oct 8, 2012
sounds like slow cranky losers. :)

good for you to roshambo with the other climber.

even if I get to a climb just before another team and I'm not ready to blast off but they are, then I figure they are first and let them go.

running to beat others to a climb may be douchey, but a fast pace walk.....sure. :)

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By Daniel Battin
From Green Mtn. Falls, CO
Oct 8, 2012
On Bridelveil
Yes, no running, but truly when are you supposed to yield the route?

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Oct 8, 2012
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Getting to the parking lot first is only part of the race. You have to actually get to the base of the route first, and that means being fast on the hike in. Everyone knows that.

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By Highlander
From Ouray, CO
Oct 8, 2012
I have been on the trail to a climb causally hiking along with my partner not in any hurry as we were the only car at the trail head, when two climbers come racing up from behind, breathing hard, sweating, trying to beat us to the base of the climb. My thoughts, what a bunch of assholes, so we went and climbed something else.
The real kicker is after climbing a 5 pitch route, we got on the route we originally intended to do and caught the above party one pitch from the top. They were fast hikers and good at running their mouth, total jabroni's.

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By Tits McGee
From Boulder, CO
Oct 8, 2012
How I Send
Once again, a great example of the Pussification of America. Foot Race to the climb for one of the only "IN" ice routes in CO? Woke up earliest, but didn't train hard enough to beat somebody in a race to the base of the route? Leave a Nasty Note in stead of handling your business man to man/face to face?

My father once told me, "You must be present to win." Sounds like a great example of a sore loser here. I thought ice climbing was one of the Hemingway type sports, but apparently, like everything else in 'MERIKA, they were entitled to the route first, because their alarm went off way too early?

If you beat me to that route, I would have cut your ropes and spit in your face, like a real sore loser. Not just left you the note, but slashed your tires and took my adze to your windshield. Cuz you are gonna pay for being better/smarter/faster and probably better looking than me dammit.

WTF is this country/state/community/forum coming to? I love/hate reading this. Thanks for sharing, however embarrassing it is that you and I and "them" fit into the same category called "climber." Sad.

Sincerely,
Tits McGee
Internet Hardman

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By Daniel Battin
From Green Mtn. Falls, CO
Oct 8, 2012
On Bridelveil
I love Tits.

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By Tits McGee
From Boulder, CO
Oct 8, 2012
How I Send
OZONE wrote:
I love Tits.


Most REAL MEN do.

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By Andrew Mayer
Oct 8, 2012
top of mt. lady washington - rmnp
In my mind, you were totally in the right for climbing the route first (first person at the base AND ready to climb AND winning roshambo with other climber who arrived at nearly the same time)

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Oct 8, 2012
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Wow. Just found this note on our car window at Garden of the Gods.



I obviously wasn't the one with the ridiculous soul patch.

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By Micahisaac
From Longmont, CO
Oct 8, 2012
soloing Boulder Canyon Upper Falls
whoever is tied in gets to go first. Good for you for being first Ozone!

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By splitclimber
Oct 8, 2012
same handwriting.

looks like someone in CO gets up late, hikes slow and gets grumpy that someone is on "their" climb. :)

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By erik rieger
From Gold Hill, CO
Oct 8, 2012
The whole point of climbing on the Peak is to avoid this bullshit—and that's why there has always been a local's ethic up there. Drawing attention to these routes on Mountain Project only exacerbates the problem by drawing-in the sort of assholes who would write a note like that.

That being said, I climbed Total Abandon this weekend. And I've climbed it many times, and among other climbers, too—without ever an incident. I was even going to solo TA this morning before driving back north...boy am I glad I missed the pride-icing on today's fuck-cake.

P.S. I believe I met OZONE once while he was ice climbing with his kid (?) and I know Trask as well (his partner). They seem to me talented climbers with a good attitude and friendly psych.

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By CJC
Oct 8, 2012
Tits McGee wrote:
My father once told me, "You must be present to win."


was he entering you in a raffle or something?

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By Bill Kirby
From Baltimore Maryland
Oct 8, 2012
Me eating a cliff bar walking back from Frankenste...
You're already ice climbing? I want to stash your tires too! Maybe the author of that love letter was from Maryland. Seriously though.. It sounds like typical early season silliness that happens everywhere. I've just come to realize that's the stuff you encounter when climbing in crowded areas.

My favorite ice climbing route is 3 hours north of Squamish. My favorite cause I've never seen anyone else climbing there.

If your tires are good then fuck'em

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By Tits McGee
From Boulder, CO
Oct 8, 2012
How I Send
CJC wrote:
was he entering you in a raffle or something?


CJC, don't make me dress you down in a stern letter published on an internet forum.

For the under enlightened, it's a nice way to say, "tough shit if you lose (or are not present)."

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By Daniel Battin
From Green Mtn. Falls, CO
Oct 8, 2012
On Bridelveil
Kirby1013 wrote:
It sounds like typical early season silliness

Kirby, you're right. Its one of the few ice routes in shape already this season. The thread tittle has been amended to reflect your insight.

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By Tits McGee
From Boulder, CO
Oct 8, 2012
How I Send

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By Dougald MacDonald
Oct 8, 2012
It would be one thing if this were a 'normal' area, where getting up early actually mattered. But the gate doesn't open until 9, and so everyone gets a fair shot at it. You were smarter and fitter, apparently didn't try to pass on a blind curve on the toll road, and you were better at ro-sham-bo. You earned it.

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By CJC
Oct 8, 2012
so in this thread we just let jokes go over our heads?

ok good to know

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By Scott McMahon
From Boulder, CO
Oct 8, 2012
Bocan
I've never had a problem with someone beating me to the route. Good for you.

On the other hand poor form is to race to beat someone to the line or pass them and then climb SLOW. That's the standard in the flatirons it seems, with all the easy access to moderate multipitch. Then I have to spend the rest of the climb having to climb underneath their ropes because they can only manage to stay 10 feet in front of me, or because I can climb faster leading a party of three than they can with 2. If you want to claim the route first, put your money where your mouth is. Don't get to the route and then bogart the whole thing because you got gassed running up the hill.

However, I've never been so upset that I would leave a note or threaten someone. It's just climbing afterall. haha it's the typical "front range ice rush".

Next question...Is it poor etiquette to not let early season ice form by knocking it all down while TRing.

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By CJC
Oct 8, 2012
splitclimber wrote:
same handwriting. looks like someone in CO gets up late, hikes slow and gets grumpy that someone is on "their" climb. :)


can't believe you fell for it. you're even worse than tits mcgee.

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By Nick Stayner
From Billings, MT
Oct 8, 2012
Nick Stayner near the crux. Ryan Minton photo.
Unless there's something more to these stories, the note-writer was clearly having a really bad day at best (fully psychotic at worst). I've got to admit that's one of the funniest "angry climber" manifestations I've ever seen.

Like everyone else has said, you were clearly in the right ozone. And to answer your question about when you yield, it's a case by case thing (as is damn near every other "ethics"-related climbing situation). We're all climbers, most of us "a cut above" as Kalous likes to say, and usually all seek reasonable solutions. Though I guess if everyone believed that, this silly forum wouldn't exist.

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By J. Albers
From Colorado
Oct 8, 2012
Bucky
OZONE wrote:
First In Line Etiquette Question ... Thoughts?


Wow, if those tool bags think you're an a-hole, then the guy that taught me to climb is the world's worst human being. The first summer that I was learning to trad climb involved something like 20+ trips up into the Park. Needless to say, by mid-summer, my mentor and I were quite fit. I think one of his favorite activities was "busting" people on the trail up to Loch or Glacier Gorge, i.e. beating people to whatever climb we were after by flying past them on the trail at mach 5. Not only that, but one of his favorite games was the following (dickish...I dunno, but pretty funny). Folks would be camped in one of the "condos" up below Spearhead and thus would have the jump on us car-to-car types that only had one day off from work to do a route. Well, when we would enter the final valley below Spearhead, my partner would keep his headlamp on and bumble his way up the trail like a gumby that didn't know where he was going. The condo folks would think, "Eh, we have 15-20 minutes till he gets here...we'll beat'm to the start". Unfortunately for them, my mentor had sent me (the young kid newb), sprinting like Seabiscuit with my lamp turned off up to the base of the climb. All of sudden they would hear me behind them, and they would let out a loud "Fuck!!!" as they knew they were hosed. I guess they shoulda gotten up earlier, eh?

In short, screw those losers. If you beat them to the climb because they are slow R-tards, then tough sh*t.

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By Brian Scoggins
From Eugene, OR
Oct 8, 2012
Stich wrote:
Wow. Just found this note on our car window at Garden of the Gods. I obviously wasn't the one with the ridiculous soul patch.


Their only valid point was the one regarding the soul patch.

Seriously folks, you owe it to your friends with soul patches to kick them in the nuts until they agree to shave that shit off.

I've always assumed that the party at the base of the route first got first dibs, but I've also known that if I spent more than 5 minutes eating/talking/peeing at the base of the route, I lose my spot in line. In crowded areas, shit or get off the pot.

FLAG


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