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Considering relo from Philadelphia to Fort Collins
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By KevinCO
From Loveland, CO
Aug 29, 2014
Living in Ft Collins you will be thankful that you are closer to Vedauwoo and Cameron Pass (avalanche awareness/paranoia). There is a lot of climbing nearby that is climbable in the winter on warmer days.

It is interesting that Allstate (or State Farm) this week reported that Ft Collins is the safest driving city in the country. By next year Ft Collins will have a new Costco, Trader Joes, and Sierra Trading Post.

Welcome to Colorado!

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By Joan Lee
Aug 29, 2014
Me
It's the safest driving "city" because there is only like one street! Jaks outdoor store there is really good. If you can also get into fly fishing and hunting you will immediately have even more drinking buddies.....and get to enjoy the whole Wyoming vibe. One advice though : don't get into meth in that part of the country.

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Aug 29, 2014
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Amanda Crawford wrote:
Okay! Thanks everyone! I'm on board. Probably will see you in October if the rest of this process goes smoothly :)


Great to hear, Amanda. Having lived in Philly for three months back in 1985, I couldn't get out of there fast enough. I grew up in a big city myself, Houston. There's nothing you can get in Philly you can't get in Denver culture-wise. You will be really close to Lumpy Ridge, which is where I'm heading tomorrow. Definitely drop me a line when you get here and make fall plans to climb down at Shelf Road.

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By Joan Lee
Aug 30, 2014
Me
^^^crusty mentor #2!!!

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Aug 30, 2014
I moved here from Philly in 2004. I've had less than 1 second of cumulative regret. Make the move.

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Aug 30, 2014
Stich wrote:
There's nothing you can get in Philly you can't get in Denver culture-wise.

This is incorrect, by a long shot.

Not saying CO isn't a couple orders of magnitude better but if you like the orchestra, food, museums, night clubs, music, ethnically centered regions (south philly, china town), etc, Denver is a cow town, it's a cultural wasteland compared to NE cities. Unless you move to Texas or Chicago don't expect the culture of one of the coasts, it isn't here.

One place CO does win hands down is in micro-brews. You don't move here for the culture, you move here for the lifestyle.

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By Joan Lee
Aug 30, 2014
Me
Merlin wrote:
This is incorrect, by a long shot. Not saying CO isn't a couple orders of magnitude better but if you like the orchestra, food, museums, night clubs, music, ethnically centered regions (south philly, china town), etc, Denver is a cow town, it's a cultural wasteland compared to NE cities. Unless you move to Texas or Chicago don't expect the culture of one of the coasts, it isn't here. One place CO does win hands down is in micro-brews. You don't move here for the culture, you move here for the lifestyle.

^^^true. Come to California for all that other stuff! Haha Colorado is for outdoorsy people but surely can get boring if you like city life etc. If you are somewhat of a hermit and enjoy getting lost in the nature you are in paradise in CO. Colorado is somewhat like West Virginia minus the rain. It's quaint. Worth checking out South Platte though!

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By Mathias
From Loveland, CO
Aug 30, 2014
Amanda,

I moved to Colorado from Manchester England 10 years ago. After living in the sticks in southern Colorado for eighteen months I moved to Fort Collins. It's a really nice place. I've found a lot of friendly people and a very relaxed atmosphere in general. In the past decade Fort Collins has expanded rather a lot due to CSU and graduates staying in town after finishing their education. It's a lot busier than it was. So a few years ago, I relocated to Loveland, the next town south. It's closer to Estes Park and Big Thompson Canyon, and also to Boulder and the playgrounds down there. Plus if you like bouldering there's Carter Lake close by and it's not a long drive up to Fort Collins to Horsetooth Reservoir. I go to a gym (Inner Strength Rock Gym) at least a couple times a week in Fort Collins. Everyone I have met there is super friendly. I'm actually going bouldering tomorrow with some people I met there. And I've also been able to climb with someone I met on this forum, who's been mentoring me a little and taking me out to some interesting places for climbing. I'd say the climbing community out this way is very open from what I've seen, though I have nothing to compare it to. It's not the "Big City" by any means, but after having grown up in one of those, I was glad of the change. It seems to me that the fewer people per square mile, and the fewer consecutive square miles of people, the nicer everyone is. :)

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Aug 30, 2014
Joan Lee wrote:
^^^true. Come to California for all that other stuff! Haha Colorado is for outdoorsy people but surely can get boring if you like city life etc. If you are somewhat of a hermit and enjoy getting lost in the nature you are in paradise in CO. Colorado is somewhat like West Virginia minus the rain. It's quaint. Worth checking out South Platte though!


I'm not knocking CO for a second, I love this state. Some might be better for alpine or big walls or desert canyons or glaciated peaks but for the over all outdoor experience CO wins hands down. I wouldn't live anywhere else.

I lived in Philly for 20 years, the front range for 8, and the western slope for 3+ years I've never looked back. If I had to move back to the front range Fort Collins would be my number one choice, good people, good beer, good climbing, good kayaking, good hiking, decent number of jobs.

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By VerticalUrge
Aug 31, 2014
Three questions:

1) Been off MP for a while. Is Joan Lee the new Eleanor?

2) @Merlin: "Unless you move to Texas or Chicago don't expect the culture of one of the coasts, it isn't here." To what part of Texas are you referring?

Also, you say Denver is a "cow town" compared to the East Coast cities in terms of culture. What is your definition of culture? Genuinely curious.

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Aug 31, 2014
Pm'd on the topic, not looking to thread derail.

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Aug 31, 2014
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Merlin wrote:
This is incorrect, by a long shot. Not saying CO isn't a couple orders of magnitude better but if you like the orchestra, food, museums, night clubs, music, ethnically centered regions (south philly, china town), etc, Denver is a cow town, it's a cultural wasteland compared to NE cities. Unless you move to Texas or Chicago don't expect the culture of one of the coasts, it isn't here. One place CO does win hands down is in micro-brews. You don't move here for the culture, you move here for the lifestyle.


Philly sucks balls. FACT. I've lived there. It's one of the most racially divided, violent shitholes I have ever had the displeasure of living in. And my friends who are from there AGREE and left. And South Street is a joke.

Denver is a cow town? Right. So is Houston to you I'm sure, despite having an excellent opera and symphony. Denver in fact has all of the culture you can force feed a bohemian beard factory. The Friday art walk down on Sante Fe is great, too. Fuck, leave Philly and regret nothing. It aint New York City or anything.


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By Amanda Crawford
From Fort Collins, CO
Sep 1, 2014
Flaking rope at Seneca
Hey hey, this is not a trash Philly thread. This is a praise Fort Collins thread, which I've enjoyed reading. We obviously have had very different Philly experiences. Considering yours was 30 years ago, I assure you things have changed. It's still racially and socioeconomically divided, but that happens in any diverse American city unfortunately.

Anyway, I'm in Fort Collins for the day today and indefinitely starting September 27! Thanks for the positive commentary and suggestions, all! Looking forward to getting to know the local climbing community!

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Sep 1, 2014
Stich wrote:
Philly sucks balls. FACT. I've lived there. It's one of the most racially divided, violent shitholes I have ever had the displeasure of living in. And my friends who are from there AGREE and left. And South Street is a joke. Denver is a cow town? Right. So is Houston to you I'm sure, despite having an excellent opera and symphony. Denver in fact has all of the culture you can force feed a bohemian beard factory. The Friday art walk down on Sante Fe is great, too. Fuck, leave Philly and regret nothing. It aint New York City or anything.


You won't find me disagreeing with a lot of what you said. I also don't lump Houston in with Denver, Houston has culture. That being said, credit where credit is due. Philly has a lot of culture and Denver can't compare both quality or quantity wise. I used to go to the Philadelphia Orchestra about 6 times a year in box seats (I have a friend who works for it). I never could get with opera but that would be anywhere. The food, museums, music, ethnic town regions, etc. slay Denver. So does any NE city or CA major city. It's a matter of perspective, saying Denver has equivalent culture is like saying Philly has equivalent climbing opportunities.

Given that I live in Junction it's clearly not a major factor for me and I'll admit that the presence of Balinese Gamelans gives Denver some street cred but the culture could be a factor if one is expecting it. You clearly have about the same view of Philly as I do but it had culture, just culture mixed in with angry. I'm guessing you didn't live there long enough to have a gun stuck in your face so it's not like I'm a huge proponent of the town.

Oh yeah, I don't regret leaving for a second.

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By RobC2
Sep 2, 2014
This..
Denver ain't no cow town, I've seen some excellent art shows there, most recently French impressionists. The Charles Deas show I saw there was eye-popping...

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Sep 2, 2014
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Merlin wrote:
I'm guessing you didn't live there long enough to have a gun stuck in your face so it's not like I'm a huge proponent of the town. Oh yeah, I don't regret leaving for a second.


I was there one semester in college and was involved in a mugging (which I ran from) and a race riot on the subway (black kids randomly beating whites). Nothing like having a mob come up to you in the subway car and announce "You're next." So yeah, I don't much care for that town. Even Joey Cusack left Philly, but that old fart Fogarty went looking for him.



I should have killed you back in Philly.

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By Jake Jones
From Richmond, VA
Sep 2, 2014
Me and the offspring walking back to the car after...
Way to drop another verbal turd in the punchbowl Trollanor.

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By Joan Lee
Sep 3, 2014
Me
Stitch is from The Springs, and let's say the lack of diversity may have made him a little close less than open minded over the last 30 years he has been there. Amanda, you will see when you get there. Springs peeps can be quite strange...

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Sep 3, 2014
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Joan Lee wrote:
Stitch is from The Springs, and let's say the lack of diversity may have made him a little close less than open minded over the last 30 years he has been there. Amanda, you will see when you get there. Springs peeps can be quite strange...


I'm actually from Texas, Houston and Austin to be exact troll baby.

Amanda, I wouldn't recommend living in CO Springs as it's a bit too tiny and you have to dig deep to find funky, cool stuff. I have a female climbing friend in Ft. Collins that would love to have a new climbing partner.

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Sep 3, 2014
Stich wrote:
I was there one semester in college and was involved in a mugging (which I ran from) and a race riot on the subway (black kids randomly beating whites). Nothing like having a mob come up to you in the subway car and announce "You're next." So yeah, I don't much care for that town. Even Joey Cusack left Philly, but that old fart Fogarty went looking for him. I should have killed you back in Philly.


I find the passage of time a bit disconcerting given my own experiences. Maybe 20ish years ago I used to commute to Temple University on a motorcycle. I was riding down Broad Street from my apartment when, at a stop light, a guy approached me and stuck a gun in my face telling me to get off of my bike. I laughed at him and said "in this neighborhood? Are you crazy", and gunned it. Looking back I'm sure I would have been terrified these days but it just seemed like another day in Philly. Must be age catching up with me.

In Junction, people hold the doors and say 'sir'. I don't regret living in Philly but I don't mind settling in Junction either. The older I get the quieter I like it. Maybe I'll retire in Marble. Philly had it's ups and downs but it was a hell of a ride when you were there.

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Sep 3, 2014
Stich wrote:
I was there one semester in college and was involved in a mugging (which I ran from) and a race riot on the subway (black kids randomly beating whites). Nothing like having a mob come up to you in the subway car and announce "You're next." So yeah, I don't much care for that town. Even Joey Cusack left Philly, but that old fart Fogarty went looking for him. I should have killed you back in Philly.


Oh yeah, funny story. I used to tutor math and physics at Temple, a co-tutor used to tell me I was a racist when I mentioned that the local kids sucker punched the white students as a game. One day, the guy came in and said some little kid had just hit him in the face and ran away. I couldn't help but find it ironic.

We had one kid in the physics department that was a parapalegic and in a wheelchair. He got mugged and had both his legs broken. We also had a 90 lb tutor knocked unconscious in a mugging and she got a severe concussion as a result. It was a rough, crazy area but at least it wasn't boring. On the upside, suburban kids are easy to handle in comparison.

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By lucander
From Stone Ridge, NY
Sep 3, 2014
Lucander off the GT Ledge on p. 2 of Keep on Strut...
The Phillies suck, the Eagles have always been losers, the 6ers haven't done jack since Umass alum Dr. J was there, and all the Flyers are known for is fighting.

Looks like there nothing left to do but climb. Wait...you can't do that in Philly.

Move now. Hope they free Mumia, the Phils can get out of a few bad contracts, cheese steak gets proven to cause something bad, and don't look back. If you're nostalgic, watch it's always sunny with your Planet Porter on a weeknight.

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Sep 3, 2014
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
Merlin wrote:
Oh yeah, funny story. I used to tutor math and physics at Temple, a co-tutor used to tell me I was a racist when I mentioned that the local kids sucker punched the white students as a game. One day, the guy came in and said some little kid had just hit him in the face and ran away. I couldn't help but find it ironic. We had one kid in the physics department that was a parapalegic and in a wheelchair. He got mugged and had both his legs broken. We also had a 90 lb tutor knocked unconscious in a mugging and she got a severe concussion as a result. It was a rough, crazy area but at least it wasn't boring. On the upside, suburban kids are easy to handle in comparison.


I actually went to Temple that one semester and stayed at the dorms at the art school at the end of Broad Street. Yeah, you were the recipient of the original punching game it sounds like. The mugging that happened to my friend and I came with about six guys surrounding us from in front and behind on the street. I saw it happening and told my friend, "Dude, we need to run!" He was oblivious and I wasn't going to argue. I ran the one block back to the school and told people to call the police. Then I went back to where we were with something I had brought with me from Texas (you can guess what that was). To my surprise, the police were already on the scene talking to my friend who only got punched in the nose for saying "fuck you" to the six guys. Tough or stupid, you decide. :-D Anyway, we got a fresh stromboli.

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By Merlin
From Grand Junction
Sep 4, 2014
Stich wrote:
:-D Anyway, we got a fresh stromboli.

:) See culture mixed with angry, good stromboli right?

Your friend would have been punched anyways, it was the local game to attack Temple students. As far as carrying goes, a lot of my professors carried and told students they were crazy if they didn't. Boulder was such a cool place to move to from Philly, it felt like utopia safety wise.

I've still got quite a few friends back in Philly who also went to Temple. Apparently the area has been gentrified and has food, bars, movie theaters, etc. I need to get back one day and see but it has apparently changed a bit in a few areas. When I was there it was mostly scary.

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By Stich
From Colorado Springs, Colorado
Sep 4, 2014
Coffee after freezing our asses off near James Pea...
I met another guy from Philly who is a climber and he goes back to visit from time to time. He tells me that if he attends a wedding, he can be assured that some sort of fistfight will break out. It's just par for the course. Yeah, just violence as a way of life. Ugh. Things are really pretty calm in Colorado by comparison. We do have the gun nuts and crazies, but fortunately they only pop up once in a while and then get nabbed.

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