South Face of Tower One 

Is the fixed pin on the first pitch worth anything? I seem to remember it being pretty questionable in 1999. Can you back it up?

The pin is decent, it will hold body weight but I wouldn't want to fall on it. I didn't have much time to inspect it but my partner said it was driven into a block that didn't look very securely attached to the slab. I didn't see any way to back it up but I got a good ballnut about 6 feet below the pin and a good TCU about 8 feet above the pin. The rock through this section is solid but it is still relatively dangerous............

How can a pin be decent despite someone not wanting to fall on it? But, and this is supposed to be reassuring, it can hold bodyweight? What good is that, except to bail? It's not an aid route. The pin is INDECENT!

I agree, if the pin barely holds body weight, it is not decent! But I take Bryson's comment to say definitely take a screamer for that piton (not that you'll see me on this route).

Bryson, Thanks for the info- I've been thinking about returning to this route. I was on this route in 1999 and I seem to remember being highly suspicious of the pin, which is why I asked. I also remember thinking that the right sized large cam (maybe #4) would have fit somewhere around the pin (above or below, can't recall) but I remember dismissing that thinking it might dislodge a block and send it as a missile at my belayer. Sounds like the same pin I saw. I think your comment added provides an assessment of the pin that is detailed enough for all to get your point.In hindsight, maybe this is a point to make in the original post about fixed gear. Hopefully that is taken as a constructive suggestion.

I posted my question about the pin as an AC- Sorry about that. I forgot to click in my name. I am not the one, however, who was shouting about the pin later. I am sorry to see that an AC is trying to get some weird satisfaction out of slamming you.

AC, For my own part, I try not to shout and I honestly try to sign everything I post and when I comment on a route. I also make sure I let people know if I have actually been on it or not- and base my comments on my own individual experience -- if the writers don't do this, it can get very difficult for readers to separate the hyperbole from the facts. For example, Bryson made his info clear, and George gave an opinion, but stated clearly that it was a general statement and that he'd not been on this route. I have no idea if you've done the route and if I had not, I'd be wondering just how bad the thing is, because you seem emphatic about how awful it is, but I don't know if you've ever even looked at it.

Also, signing your name to a post is critical info, so that a pattern can be established. People may say "Gee-wiz, I can climb that because JohnDoe is very conservative about what he calls and S" or "I am not going to attempt that because in my experience, JohnDoe is a sandbagger." For my own part, I frequently use the FA information in guidebooks to make healthy decisions about my route choices. By way of example, I generally don't try to do Alec Sharp 5.11's or Derek Hersey S-rated routes while on-sight leading.

Hopefully this can also be taken as constructive.

Tony,

Damn right about that comment on Alec Sharp 5.11's! It is amazing that guy could get off the ground with balls that big. His routes are, in general, extremely serious. Most of the time his routes are marked S or VS, though.

Bill

AC, there are a lot of "good" pins that I don't want to fall on, I try to avoid falling. Which ones do you "want" to fall on? Sign your name.

Decent does not mean good, [relatively] dangerous means just that.

I appreciate the constructive suggestions, I really do not want to mislead anyone about this route, as I have said it IS dangerous. All things considered I should probably revise my [assessment] of the pin. I DO NOT KNOW if it would hold a fall, if you think you will end up testing it, don't try this climb. The pin holds body weight and this is significant even if it is not an aid climb because If you can take before the crux to help avoid a dangerous fall in my opinion it is worth noting. This route is not for everyone, the crux is not the only dangerous part. I am not trying to dupe people into trying a dangerous route and I am sorry if that is the impression people got. I enjoyed this route and will do it again. Tony, thank you for your suggestions, will consider what you said when adding routes in the future.Peace..................

...I replaced the pin a few months ago, on the lead, while doing "Mushy Peas." It was ...and came out very easy. Now there is a well-placed #4 Lost Arrow. The crack, however, is expanding so I wouldn't put much faith in the pin alone. When I whacked the pin in, the crack opened up enough to squeeze in a #0000 cam and a #3 Camalot can be placed about 1 ft. underneath it, so it doesn't feel as scary as when I led it 6 or 7 years ago. --B.B.

Some notes, having just done the first pitch Saturday before being rained off, then the whole thing on Sunday.

The pin on the first pitch is not that great- It's OK, but not great. I'd loathe to fall far on it. THe #4 or #3.5 Camalot below is a decent placement in dubious rock. The next piece down is some distance. It is certain that to feel good about this lead you either have to be solid at the grade (confident you won't fall) or capable of convincing (fooling) yourself that the gear is good.

Next note- this climb is easily done in 2 pitches with a 70M rope- one to the top of the tower above the first good ledge in the corner (~160') and then one out left under the roof and up the yellow Spur Arete (~215').

Finally led the crux pitch last weekend but didn't have time to do the last two pitches. The middle pitch is what I really want to do.

This felt barely S to me, with 2 big cams below the pin and a nut at the pin. The move right felt easy to me, maybe 10a if you can reach far enough sideways. After the move right you can get a microcam in the flake that I'm sure would hold body weight, but not much more, since the flake is thin. This provides a bailout option if you need it. The moves above are only 8 or 9 to the shallow corner.

The hard part for me was getting the gear in the corner. My fingers latched into the hole that takes the best cam. I got a decent brass nut higher, but wasn't totally happy. The moves into the corner are annoyingly difficult. Maybe only 9, but you don't want to risk falling.

I know that my description makes this sound pretty much like an S climb, but I felt pretty safe as opposed to, say, on Backtalk, also 10c S, on which you risk a huge fall on climbing of similar difficulty with no chance for gear until the bad pin.

A very worthy route, esp if you're tired of the same old, same old. Its rarely traveled status gives it an old time (licheny) feel.

This reach impaired climber found the crux to be solid for the grade, for first thing that pops into my head comparison's sake, harder than XM. That said, the crux is literally one move with much easier climbing immediately before and after and it is well protected -- I was able with some difficulty to reach right at the start of the crux and place a solid #4 RP sized micro nut.

I can't believe people don't rave about the second pitch which is continuous, well protected and somewhat out there. It might be possible to approach this pitch from the end of Body Tremors with a little downclimbing if you don't feel like messing with the first pitch.

I felt cheated on the crux pitch. With all of the hype the crux pitch gets, I was expecting some hard moves above iffy gear. This may be the easiest 5.10c at Eldo. If you bring the right gear, it is also very well protected. The money pitch is the 50-60ft roof traverse on pitch 2. I think this 5.9+ pitch is a more demanding lead than the "crux" pitch.

An old timie route with lots of hype not climbed much. Sounds good to me. Think I'll lead it this week. Cool.

So, I led this route last Friday. Cool, we had the whole canyon to ourselves, good line. My first line in Eldo. I'll be back for sure. Oh, no need for all the Hype. The pin is good. :o