I was recently told by an AMGA rock guide that the ovehand knot is bomber for joining two ropes to rap off of and as a replacement for the double fishemans for tying cordage into a cordelette. I have also been informed that that is what NOLS is also teaching. Am I mistaken?

What do you guys think about this?

You are referring to the European death knot. It is only bomber if you know what you are doing. People have died using it incorrectly. I use it almost always during rappels, I can't imagine why you would use it for tying cordage. For raps-yeah. For cordage-Nay.

using the EDK with rappel ropes-you need to leave a long tail, 18in to 2 feet on both of the ropes you tied together. Don't know about with cordalette, although I have seen it used and the guide claimed it works fine.

The EDK is a great knot, leave a good sized tail or tie two EDKs

Part of the appeal of the EDK is its low profile. It doesn't get stuck in cracks and whatnot as easily as other knots when you're pulling the rope after a rappel. But make sure you tie it right - leave a tail like Mike described, and tie a knot in the tail for backup.

Dressing the knot and tail length are VERY key. Otherwise it's a worthy knot for the right situation. I use it, but mainly for situations where I have specific concern about the knot catching. Otherwise, I use the double or triple fisherman's.

I would never use it for a cordelette, because of the attention it requires. That comment doesn't make sense to me.

Definitely read here; Look at the EDK study:
http://www.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/

Read here for other related discussions:
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/general_climbing/knot_quest>>>>>
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/climbing_gear_discussion/sk>>>>>

I use the overhand knot for rappelling. I like it because it does not snag easily. I make sure the knot has long tails (at least 18 inches). I pull hard on each of the four ends sticking out. Then I pull on each one again. Then I tie an overhand knot as a stopper in one of the 18 inch tails and snug the stopper down against the knot to resist roll over. An old time Gunks climber taught me this procedure.

Has anyone actually had a flat overhand roll on them or their partner while rapping?

I've never seen it.

Haven't had a problem with strands of 2 different diameters either.

• bashfully* "oops..."

I've had an overhand roll into the backup overhand twice before. Twin 8mm ropes; both times in the alpine with multiple rappels and the ropes were wet.

Always tie a backup. I usually do two overhands, but one overhand on both and another overhand snugged up on one of the tails works just as well.

Tie off or fall off.

Any opinions on using a rethreaded figure-8 (end-to-end, NOT parallel, and with long tails)? I learned to use this from a friend who's a long-time climber and guide, and it's bomber as far as I can tell. Also reasonably easy to untie when you get to the ground.

JL

Will - for what its worth - I was also told the same thing by an AMGA guide a number of years ago and started using this technique with great success. I have found the over hand knot presents less drag over corners making ropes, easier to pull, and is over all more efficient. Best of luck.

I was at the New River Rendezvous a couple of years back and took a self-rescue course. I seem to recall the instructor recommending using the EDK for a cordalette. I never did try it. I have used the EDK for a prussick cord used to back up a rappel below the device (can't remember what this is called). I have not had any problems.