Alright, I have a question with a probably really simple answer.

Is it acceptable to tie a clove hitch with a doubled up strand of rope? I ask because I usually make equalettes by clove hitching the 2 points with a single strand of cordalette. Then, I tie an 8 on a bite on the doubled up coradlette for the last point(like the honker knot for TR master points). I was thinking that just clove hitching that point as well would be faster and more flexible. Is there a reason not to do that?

Evan

need picture

I'm not sure if I understand your description, but it sounds like something I wouldn't want to do.

To attach yourself to an anchor? That you'll be putting your life on? And your partner's? I'd rephrase your question: "Is there a reason to do that?"

I think I'm following you. Imagine you're using 4 anchor points (instead of, apparently, three). You'll be clove hitching two points with one "half" of the equalette, like you're already doing. The other "half" would be clove hitched similarly to the other two points. Now imagine you've got three anchor points. The second "half" of the equalette could be clove hitched to that point the same way as if there were two points there. You don't have to make the clove hitch with the doubled up equalette. Does that make sense? If it makes sense, does anybody see any reason not to do it that way? Of course, you lose the redundancy of not using the second strand, but what's more likely to fail: the strand itself or the anchor piece?

How about this:

Equalette with 3 anchor points Submitted By: Richard Radcliffe on Jul 27, 2009

ask at rockclimbing.com

You'll get more than an earfull of responses, pictures, diagrams, physics equations, etc...

I think he means something like this:

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for thread Submitted By: Daryl Allan on Jul 27, 2009

Evan - do you mean this?:

equalette with all cloves Submitted By: Gregger Man on Jul 27, 2009

ok, so not to hijack, but what exactly is the difference between a cordolette and an equalette?

In the unlikely event that a section of cordalette breaks between the overhand and the carabiner, it is no longer attached to the carabiner. Now refer to Gregger Man's photo above. A clove hitch will hold one strand of cordalette should a break between the overhand and the carabiner occur. You could effectively break one strand from each piece in the anchor and still be alive.
I don't know how useful this is in practice though. I would think a clove hitch (between a hard carabiner and rock) would be more likely to be abraded than a section between the clove and overhand. If the clove hitch doesn't hold, what I said above is useless.

I think your system is pretty slick, the doubled cloves are not a problem unless they crossloaded the biner which seems unlikely. The best part is that the clove slipping would actually equalize the loading on each piece.

What I don't like is that I could do the same thing with a bunny-ear knot and a shoulder sling, take 1/3 or less of the time, and still have a safer setup due to the dynamic nature of my rope. Escaping my anchor would take more patience but I think the time saved would increase my safety margin in most multi-pitch settings.

KISS is still king.

Here is a pic of the bunny ear equal.

Bunny ear equalization. Submitted By: Kevin Stricker on Jul 28, 2009

Kevin, you're out of paper towels... thought you should know.

Moof-
This isn't the system that I use. I saw the dorkalette post over at bigwalls.com and was applying that to Evan's question. The 4-piece version of this anchor with cloves up top and sliders at the bottom is interesting, though. Perhaps a bit over-engineered.

I have been using an equalette for about a year and a half now after I saw it for the first time on another forum. I built a few and quickly decided that I liked it and would give it a try. As I climbed with different people, many did not like it because they felt it was too complicated but no one felt it was unsafe. As I used it more and more I began to appreciate it more and more.

Speed:
I keep my shock load limiting knots pre-tied, I can set this up faster than most other anchor systems, including a pre-equalized cordalette. Once you get familiar with it, it really is not complicated, I actually think it is quite simple.

Safety:
Besides the obvious safety advantages I can add up to 4 equalized points if I feel the need with almost no extra effort.

Usefulness:
After you have this thing set up, you can do things like change its direction of pull or add pro without removing it from the protection you have in place, just adjust the cloves. You don't have to break down any part of this anchor to make changes. The slack in the loops usually left over are great for hanging packs, water bottles, etc..

I can understand why some are not interested because it appears complex. Go climb with it a little and see if it grows on you.

Close.....garage wall actually....:)

I like your "Patio Gym", looks like your daughter is a natural.

Now back to equalettes.....

No one else likes the bunny ear equalizing knot eh? Why carry extra gear for an anchor when you can use your rope?

Kevin I dont think that setup is actually equalized. By using the rope at the master point how you have it you put 50% of the load on the piece on the right, connected with the rope, and 25% to each of the two pieces with the slider sling. There is a way to make a triple bunny ear knot which would mitigate this problem and use even less gear. Back to the orignal question........ Rope slippage on the doubled rope clove is probablly not that much of a concern, one could simply add another carabiner to that piece and tie two separate cloves. This setup is not after simplicity so whats another biner in the mix?