Its been a few years since CCH got a bad rap and I, along with a lot of others, sold all of mine and stopped using them. It seems that they have got their act together now and quality control is better. Do you think that Aliens are still the way to go with the other units that are out now like master cams and C3s? I like the C3's a lot and the master cams are pretty good but I miss my aliens.

I can't ever seem to place a metolius cam without nearly overcamming it, so I don't care for Master cams.

However, you forgot about Zeros, which (now that they're 3rd generation or something) are really good as small pro. I still trust a black Alien more than a gray Zero, but that's the only time its an issue. Aliens are still my favorite, but Zeros are easier to get, and more reliable QC-wise.

hybrid aliens are even better. do that.

I love my little aliens (green, blue), but I gotta admit, C3's fit in a lot of places they don't, and despite some smack talk about them I have never once had an issue and they have held all little whippers I've taken on them beautifully.

Well here we go again "zeee ode are zee Aliens safe ploy"

If you have doubts than don't use em. But from your comments sounds to
me like you want to so here's my take

I have been using Aliens for years ever sense they came out in fact
I still use and have fallen on the dimpled ones I have and will continue to use them until the fricken head pops off .

The Master cam is no replacement for the Alien.... Period

The Zero's are as close as it gets but the Aliens beat them up too

BD C3s'are not even in the same league..I never liked em and sold my set last year.If I have to go small on a tcu than I would rather have the grey ghost Just my take on em, glad yours work for you

and I agree that the offset Aliens are even better than any offset
cam out there.

D.O. for the overcamming of the Metolius Masters though I own a set and like them when and where they work..

I like the Metolius offsets for certain situations- lumpy ridge,soft rock and some times they work better than an Alien .

I just bought my 5th set of Aliens black through red to be brought
into service on aid climbs or whenever my oldest ones finally turn to dust.

So im just an old aid/trad/ice climber that can still hang with the big dogs most of the time WTF do I know ? I know I like and will continue to use aliens till I can nolonger climb.

Cheers
ICE....

For year after year after year, Aliens were sold out nearly all the time at most shops in most major west coast metropolitan areas.

I know its crazy the falling out that they have had.

I am of the opinion that I am more likely to get injured diddling with a tricky placement than from a gear failure-even if I was climbing on a recalled unit(which no one would do).

That said, I like masters, but not as much as aliens. C3's are better for certain placements than aliens, but aliens do place the best in many placements.

Just my 2 cents
Cheers

Evan

Dave, Im still a die hard aliens fan. They just fit the best in everything to me and are easier to handle. The metolius and C3's are too stiff for my liking and the C3's arent field reperable.

Mountain Shop in Fort Collins almost always has the Alien old faithfuls in full stock, including hybrids. Give em a ring and ask for this old codger named Mitch.

Aliens are the best micro cams out there, everything else is just second best. I've been using them for at least 10 years and will never buy anything else.

Seems a lot of people can't shake their fanboy emotional attachment. I'd imagine that alone will float the company for some time, at least until the recent lawsuits kick in.

I'd agree they place quite well, perhaps the best in some situations, but I can't say I think they are safe or worth the tradeoff in the complete lack of faith I have when looking down at one.

There's nothing quantitative they offer. BD, for example, states a 3 sigma breaking strength. Not that I care about breaking strength, however, it says a process is in place to quantitatively measure and monitor outgoing product in a meaningful way. You have to break things to get that. Pull testing is meaningless. Anyway, CCH doesn't have it.

It's absolutely surprising to me that they haven't put statistical process control in place given all the hassles, especially since it's so 101 to the rest of the manufacturing world. It basically says to me a bullheaded idiot is running the place. That said, no thanks. Maybe it's 1/10,000 - but is that one mine?

BTW, if you are climbing with a dimpled Alien and you think that's cool - you're an idiot!! Just gotta call that one out for what it is. There are people walking around with screws in their bones and metal plates in their heads due to those things. Maybe you're one of them and just forgot?

why would you climb on a dimpled alien, when you know that you can return it for one that is good, for free? i dont understand the logic behind that

I live in the boulder area and Neptunes stopped carrying them and boulder mountaineering never has a full set, neither does bent gate, CCH needs to get in with one of the big online guys like mgear or backcountry

Hey guys,

I'm going to throw this out here because its a major safety issue but withhold the details until I get my writeup to CCH later today and have a long chat with Dave. I'm the guy who took his pull tester down to the New River Rendezvous to do some fundraising for NRAC and anyone who was there knows the reasons for concern.

Until then if you haven't yet gotten every single one of you Aliens individually proof tested yet do it now, regardless of the manufacture date. Please, please, PLEASE do not climb on them until you've had them proof tested.

Details will be forthcoming very soon so kindly don't get the speculation and rumor mill started as I'd like to give Dave an opportunity to handle this properly.

-aric.

I am heading out on a trip on thursday and I need to know if the aliens I have are ok can you share some details after you talk to dave

Hey Dave,

I don't think you'll have an answer before your trip so my advice is to see if you could borrow some gear from someone else. I sent CCH an email yesterday ~noon EST and haven't heard anything back. I also spoke with Rich @ Rock&Snow at the Gunks (they still carry Aliens) and he said he'd call them, but I don't know if he did or not. I'm in the middle of writing a full report on this for them and will have it out in an hour or two.

What the hell... You guys here at MP are much more level headed than the monkeys at RC and its not like a dozen people didn't see it happen (and 700+ the results since I had it sitting out on the display of broken gear). I had a Red from 2002 fail at ~5kN (stem pulled from the head with no braze material on it and 2002 is 2 years before the beginning of the dimple/recall period) and a Purple from 2005 at ~11kN (axle appears to have missed heat treatment and went C-shaped, which is AFAIK a new failure mode for Aliens). I have pics of the cams before the tests, in the fixture prior to testing and complete datalogs of the applied force (at 1000 samples/sec) since it was done on my tensile tester.

This just happened Saturday and I'm trying to let CCH take ownership of the issue and handle it properly, so please give this time to happen. I have not announced this on RC yet as I'm a mod over there and we're kicking around the best way to avoid any issues surrounding that. But since I'm just a regular Joe here, what the hell.

Climb safe everyone.

All of mine say tensile tested on them so they should be ok

One other thing to keep in mind, their recall was more extensive than the dimple, it was revised to incorporate a date range; which I can't remember off the top of my head.