By Nick Stayner
From Tuolumne Meadows, CA
Feb 27, 2008
| I searched to see if anyone had brought this up already, but I couldn't find anything. Anyway... does anyone know how the 3rd generation units overlap with the second in the larger sizes (3.5, 4, 5, 6)? |  |
By Mark Cushman
From Erie, CO
Feb 27, 2008
| jon jugenheimer wrote: http://www.bdel.com/gear/camalots.php click on "compare" a graph will come up and show you the ranges
Those are the new Camalots. The older ones had a size 3.5, the new ones do not. Nick, I have the 3.5 and a 4, I can measure if you really want me to. | |
By Perin Blanchard
Administrator
From Orem, UT
Feb 27, 2008
| Mark Cushman wrote: Those are the new Camalots.
And the chart shows the previous generation in comparison. | |
By jon jugenheimer
From Madison
Feb 27, 2008
| look at the graph and you will see two sets of cam, the newer ones in color, and the older ones in gray scale.
now the graph doesnt give you the best data, but its all i came up with in that short of time. | |
By Nick Stayner
From Tuolumne Meadows, CA
Feb 27, 2008
| Thanks. When I looked at that chart, I didn't even notice the gray ones. I thought it was for weight comparison. | |
By Avery Nelson
From Boulder, CO
Feb 27, 2008
| Nick,
Go here and have a look at the info Clyde Soles compiled. You can find previous generation cams lower in the list, too. Cut and paste to excel if you can't read what you need.
Note: If I recall correctly, he says he applied some formula to each cam mfg's provided range to determine a 'usable range' (so they may not match up with the mfg claimed ranges). | |
By Mark Cushman
From Erie, CO
Feb 27, 2008
| jon jugenheimer wrote: look at the graph and you will see two sets of cam, the newer ones in color, and the older ones in gray scale.
Gah, I guess I thought those were drop shadows at first glance. My bad. | |
By Shumin Wu
Feb 27, 2008
| Avery Nelson wrote: Nick, Go here and have a look at the info Clyde Soles compiled.
The only thing I'll say about that is John swears there's a gap between the C4 #4 and #5, and according to the site, there is no overlap in the usable range between the 2. If I climb that size OW more I guess I'd know, too. | |
By Stymingersfink
Feb 27, 2008
| Shumin Wu wrote: The only thing I'll say about that is John swears there's a gap between the C4 #4 and #5, and according to the site, there is no overlap in the usable range between the 2. If I climb that size OW more I guess I'd know, too.
I'd have to guess that clyde's site, having included the old 3.5 and 4.5 sizes, would not include the current C4 ranges.
I've several of the C4 sizes 4,5,&6... Holding them in my hands, I would have to say there's a fair amount of overlap in what I would consider "usable range" between the respective adjacent cam... slightly more range overlap with the 4&5 C4's than the 5&6 C4's, but man that 6 gets big FAST! | |
By Avery Nelson
From Boulder, CO
Feb 27, 2008
| Stymingersfink wrote: I'd have to guess that clyde's site, having included the old 3.5 and 4.5 sizes, would not include the current C4 ranges.
The graph doesn't include stats for C4's. The 'Cams by Brand' spreadsheet does. | |
By Stymingersfink
Feb 27, 2008
| Avery Nelson wrote: The graph doesn't include stats for C4's. The 'Cams by Brand' spreadsheet does.
and according to that spreadsheet, there is no overlap in his approximation of "usable range".
I happen to believe one's results in the field may not quite follow the spreadsheet, however. There's a bit of difference between utilizing a cam near it's absolute minimum range, and getting it stuck due to overcamming. It's all going to depend on the rock type, the placement, and one's skill in placing/cleaning the piece.
Of course, when aiding one has the pleasure of having nothing but time to determine the absolute best placement one is willing to settle for.
When climbing the OW you're probably be utilizing those pieces on, they'll be pushed up the crack ahead of you till the crack either opens up or closes down, meaning you'll be leaving that piece behind for pro and making it necessary to switch to the next size up or down anyway.
So... where's the problem? | |
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