so, yesterday I placed a Specter (Ice Hook) piton and a couple Long Dongs on an A2 first ascent. a couple lessons:
- don't overdrive pitons.........
- Specters hold SO WELL they should only be used when normal pins
won't provide sufficient pro (they leave a bigger pin scar and take
longer to remove)
- When placing a specter, clip junk carabiners through both the top
and bottom holes to prevent accidentally hammering past the clip in
points.
- Long Dongs are too long to work well in odd placements, and should
only be used in perfectly straight in cracks. the end can bend
around an unseen corner and make it very hard to remove. besides,
the right size blade or lost arrow will work better there anyway.
- Long Dongs are great for heavy cleaning and a backup pin that can
fit a lot of places.


anyone else have experience with these pitons?

• *note: this route was on an out of the way crag that is good enough for adventure cragging, but destined to never become popular, so clean climbing is not an issue.

in 20 years climbing in the desert I've never used a long dong and don't own any.

I can always get something else either a short pin or a ball nut.

specter's are to be used sparingly just for the notes you made or in really poor rock where one won't notice.

I used to have a long dong as a nut tool. Fine weight behind it. I even hand placed it behind a block I was sitting on for part of an anchor.

OK for what it's worth(not much)
I have to agree w/rickd in the fact that I've only used a long dong fer a nut tool... Except for the one time I hammered one in, needless to say I think it's still fixed where we left it 20 yrs ago in the big ditch, can't remember the route Jolly Roger comes to mind....

As far as specters I've been toying with the idea of using mine for aid as they SUCK in MOH for ice climbing,(just one more thing to jab ya in the ass) but I only wish to use them as a thin large hook (kinda like a great big pika ibis, only stronger)I don't see the need to hammer on em but then again IM new to the sandstone game. GOG here in Colorado springs being the only place I've played around w/ ss aid....Don't know if this helps...

Cheers
Iceman....

I've now sawed off my Spectre according to instructions on http://psychovertical.com/?diymixedhook
placed it a week ago on aid, clip junk biners through both the top hole and bottom hole before hammering, then don't hammer too hard. this time it came out after loosening it with the first funkness pull (off the top hole, inline with the beak part)
held like a charm where a lost arrow didn't hold in a thin lichen crusted crack

just placed the sawed off spectre again yesterday, (same spot as previously) (there is a good constriction, but pretty grungy for putting a nut in.) Held great with just a few hammer hits, then came out with a few upward taps, then yanked it out by hand!
I'm definitely a fan. It's just a massive beak

I used Kate's Spectre a couple times recently on some A4 expando on Zed-Em and BUBS, and it worked really well. As she points out, you would have to pull the thing through a LOT of rock before it would fail.

Never used a Long Dong, except for cleaning nuts and stuff.

I have very few KB's on my rack anymore, having replaced them pretty much with the two sizes of big Peckers, which are truly superb! Anyone wanna buy some KB's?

is Kate's spectre sawed off? I've really liked the shortened version, although the full length would have it's placements too.

Full-length Spectre. I think sawing it off would defeat the purpose.