I kind of want to make this as constructive as possible, so if some anger creeps through, please remember that.

I've been hearing some pretty bad stories about climbers at Enchanted Tower (NM) lately. The most recent involve lots of poop paper below the climbs, climbers plowing brand new campsites into the middle of the meadow areas, climbers having fires when there are posted signs that ban campfires, and climbers who let the rancher's cattle out the gate into the place (man, this is SO bad for us).

I've been at this game long enough to be worn out on lecturing climbers about maintaining good behavior, low-impact climbing practices, and the like, but geeze guys and gals, this is a pretty cool place to climb with a lot of great routes and we are VERY lucky to be able to access it, especially considering the easy way in is via private land. We've already lost enough climbing areas through no fault of our own to have to fight an access problem that we created ourselves.

Any chance we could clean up our act and maybe speak up when you see other climbers doing things they ought to know better than doing? I'd think we'd all be pretty serious about maintaining the access we have and not having to come back later, hat in hand, to beg for one more chance?

Maybe I'm way off here. I'd like to hear from others who have seen some of this stuff and maybe we can get the peer pressure rolling to clean it up and keep this area from becoming one big dirt (or mud) lot full of trash that we can no longer visit to climb.

I hear you, and I definitely got your back.

I agree Greg. EC is an AMAZING place to climb- its setting and beauty are unmatched. There is no need for such foolish shenanigans- cmon' climbers(those that are guilty)- we have enough access issues as it is w/o being part of our own demise.

Access to EC is a priviledge that we should not take for granted. The landowner has tolerated more than we should have put on them. Grow up and be thankful, considerate and responsible. And those of us who witness it should step up and say something.

Having access to EC is something that should be respected- here and at every climbing area you go too- as this sport is always in the limelight for its impact. Thus, LEAVE NO TRACE. Enough said. Thanks.

Hi Greg, thank you for posting this. While I haven't been personally guilty of any of the activities you mention and consider myself to be very LNT conscious and respectful of access, the last time I was there I neglected to say something to a group of campers that had a campfire during the fire ban. I should have said something. I will next time.

Actually the last time we were there I really thought about the solid waste issue. The camping around there is pretty consolidated and with every climber doing his/her "morning constitutional" in the area, it's got to get bad soon. I decided to order a number of Restop 2 packages for use next time there (and other busy locales). A five-pack is only $15 at REI. I've used these before in areas that required them (Grand Teton, etc.) but never voluntarily. It's time for me to change my old habits and I hope others will follow suit. I wonder if an organization like NMCRAG might support a mass-purchase of the Restop 2s and distribute them down at the tower along with some "educational" signage. There's an easily accessible dumping location right at Datil where one could stop at on the way home...

Thanks for the support guys. I'd hate to see us have to fight some sort of access battle over this nice area when all we have to do is stand up and do the right thing. Pretty easy for us to love a small enclosed place like this to death if we're not careful with everything we do.

Thanks for the "bottoms-up" on this Greg. Human waste & fires during restrictions seem to be a problem all too often.

For instance, just last week at Holcomb Valley Pinnacles we came across an unattended campfire outside the climbing area. Needless to say, we were not thrilled as....

1) There were SEVERAL posted FS signs indicating campfire restrictions.

2) The fire was left unattended

3) At the time there were reports of 1300 fires in California at the time.

As it is, we were unable to confront... I mean educate... I mean politely explain to the offending party. Instead one of my partners decided to empty the water from campers ice chest into the pit and extinguish it.

Spread the word people. Our public lands and access to them should be more important than people thinking you're a jerk.

~Susan

Good topic Greg. I have found that if I mention the access issue to people they are pretty receptive to being better stewards. It might be important to ask everyone that says "ET is awesome you should go" to also tell folks about the access issues. As far as the dookey issue goes I always brought a good shovel and walked a hundred yards or so. I never did find anyones buried treasure either. I haven't been there in a couple of years so maybe there are more people there, or they are just more full of crap. Education is the key I hope.

I think we should hit up the Access Fund and/or other local climbing organizations for some pit toilets as there is not much real estate left available. Until then practice pack it in pack it out philosophy and bring a portable pooper. It would be a bummer to see this excellent area closed due to clueless and disrespectful climbers.

Poop's part of the issue, but the illegal fires are a much bigger and obvious problem (sure, it's been raining there in the forest, but it'll still burn . . . ) Besides, the local ranchers may just decide that they don't need to risk their livelihoods to some either illiterate (signs clearly posted at the ranch entrance) or just plain arrogant rock climbers and their superior knowledge of the moisture content of the surrounding fuel sources.

Letting cows out of the gate is just plain dumb. If there are cows near a gate without a cattle guard (like the one there at the ranch) then either wait the situation out or use the alternate entrance. (Go have lunch or dinner in "town")

And then there are the free range dogs and their uncaring, absentee owners ("my dog's the nicest dog in the world, never snapped at anybody before this time . . . ") . . . and the TP/napkin paper held down by rock paper weights at the bottom of way too many routes . . . and the cat on the leash . . . and the circle of pop-up campers . . .

Yeah, we are our own worst enemy. Better than a day at the circus . . .

Fred

I am not much for sport climbing but I do enjoy Enchanted Tower and hate to see all this. I only make it out there a few times a year and every time I go it seems way worse. Where people poop is a horrible thing to manage and I think that we should all take it upon ourselves to let other climbers know to pack it out. If only someone could come up with a catchy slogan to promote this.

NMCRAG has done a significant amount of work at the Tower. Including many hours spent building trails, erecting a kiosk, lining all the campsites with rocks so people don't destroy the vegetation (thanks Sal), building belay platforms, and meeting with the access road landowners yearly to maintain good relations (thanks Bryan). As Bob mentioned, NMCRAG has approached the FS about a toilet, but they want nothing to do with it. We have a unique situation where climbers are basically the only users of the canyon, with no one controlling our actions. If we trash the place that will be truly a sad situation, and does not speak well for our user group. BTW, one of the biggest issues with the owners of the access road is climbers coming in after dark, and driving too fast. With all the work that has been done there it would be sad to lose access. Do not hesitate to educate climbers on how to behave.

Why would someone wrap draws in tinfoil? Perma-draws can be very useful, esp for cleaning, but tinfoil? That's new.

Tinfoil, sounds like a novel, albeit obnoxious approach to UV weathering.

i recently made my first visit out to the tower (july 4th weekend) and indeed witnessed campfires. i saw the signs but it didnt occur to me to question why this particular group was above the rules, i guess i either figured they knew something i didnt or it just wasnt that big of a deal. in hindsight i feel pretty dumb not to even bring it up with them. i cant even begin to describe how much i truly enjoyed this place, so i'm glad to have run into this post. next summer, rest assured there will be no campfires while i'm there! as far as the waste issue goes, i took a shovel, again in hindsight i probably could have been walking a bit farther out and packing my paper out instead of burying it. next time i will pack out my paper and walk further out to bury my duties.

for the record i didnt see anyones droppings around our site or by the routes. (i stayed at the first site on the right)

long live enchanted towers access!

The idea behind the "tin foil" is actually some type of heat resistance tape is to protect the slings from UV exposure. The perma draws aren't mine but I did hang the double length one at the crux of Red / White Queen. I believe that the person who hung all the other draws is planning to remove them at the end of the season.

Personally I feel that the permadraws even with the shiny reflective coating are less of an eyesore than the damaged trees next to Babies wall and Grendel. There isn't much left of the tree next to Grendel anymore. I realize there are other ways to avoid swinging into the trees after cleaning these routes, but judging from the trees not many people use these other methods.

If any Enchanted Tower climbers have serious issues with the fixed draws then I will remove the one I hung the next time I am down there.

What do others thing of permanent camo'd chain draws? I've considered replacing the shiny draws with these.

You know Kirra I have dogs so I guess I look at it the same way but I guess other don't. The wag-bag is a good idea.

I'm curious about the campfire ban... Are you ever allowed to have fires at the tower? Is that a permanent ban or a seasonal ban? I was there a week ago and the place was drenched. It had been raining for weeks, everything was super green and dripping wet, our campsite was a mud puddle.. Probability of ignition 0%. A pyromaniac with a dozen drip torches full of burn mix couldn't have gotten the meadows to burn. And yet, there is the big sign at the entrance that says "No Campfires", looking weathered like it had been there for years. I know in Flag there are seasonal campfire closures, that's why I ask.. Seems like the tower closure must be a permanent one, or if its a seasonal closure they don't seem to be paying any attention to fire danger (very low when I was there last).

Tavis - I'd guess that because E-Tower is so far out in the middle of BFE, that the signs don't get pulled too quickly even if it gets soaked down. I would seriously doubt the ban is permanant.

Saw on the news that the Dolly rain we were supposed to get in AZ mostly ended up in New Mexico last weekend.

WAG bags might be a good solution, but most climbers are probably too dainty these days to exercise that as a solution to human waste around there. Could be worth pursuing, though. That was a good one about people picking up dog poo, Kirra. But then, from what I see in the parks around Phx, a lot of folks don't seen to pick that up either...

Dainty or not, I think there needs to be a shift in thinking if we're going to keep the small area surrounding the tower a nice one as more and more visitors come to the area.

I added some information to the main page about this: Enchanted Tower

If anyone has any other helpful suggestions, I would appreciate it.

I am considering building some kind of wooden container to attach to the kiosk so that people can have a place to put donated wag bags. Would this be helpful? Or, would it be a problem if I went and screwed an addition to the current kiosk?

Thoughts?

Tony