Acceptable Rope Marking Pens?

Any advice as to which pens, other than the Blue Water brand, are safe to use for marking a rope's halfway point? Thanks...

According to studies I've seen, there are no pens that safely
mark ropes. Your best bet is to purchase a rope with a middle
mark already on the rope, or buy a bi-colored rope which changes
patterns at the middle of the rope. Beal offers both.

The one study I heard of found that ropes marked were slightly less strong if the mark fell directly and squarely on an edge. Since it is much more likely that you could rappel off the ends of your rope due to them being uneven, it's a much better bet to just mark the thing with a Sharpie and not concern yourself with this issue IMHO.

This info came from an article in either Climbing or R & I, a few years ago. It identified the following as acceptable rope marking pens: the Carter (brand) MARKS ALOT; the Sanford SHARPIE; the Binney Smith MAGIC MARKER. Bluewater used to sell a rope marking pen, also. Accurate info in the magazine article? I've used the Sharpie....

This is the much debated topic.

Below is what Beal has to say about their rope marking product.

I also called both Edelweiss and BlueWater, as I have their ropes, too. Edelweiss indicated they had tested and approved for use the Beal Rope Marker. BlueWater does not approve marking any ropes; however, I think they're made of the same material. If I remember correctly, the Beal marker is also approved for use on Mammut Ropes -- do verify that.

My take on this is that yes, the tested Beal marker can affect the strength marginally (it does stiffen the rope slightly, so apply lightly). Note that, per below, the Beal ropes are manufactured and tested with THE SAME MARKING COMPOUND applied!

You can count on one hand the number of time's you've heard about rope failures. You can't count on one hand how many times you've heard of someone rapping off the end of their rope!!! You choose. As Ron would say -- focus on what's important.

As a side note: not all ropes are made as bi-color, for instance the Mammut Super-Safe (which is ink marked at 3 locations).

Just my $0.02

From: Annie xxxxx [mailto:xxxxx@bealplanet.com] On Behalf Of Webmaster
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2006 4:39 AM
To: Avery Nelson
Subject: RE : middle-marking ropes

Dear Avery,

Thank you for your interest in our products.

The rope marker sold by Black Diamond is a BEAL product, and yes it is the one we use to middle-mark our ropes.

They are no effect on the strength and performances of the rope.

If you are living in the Colorado state you might find the rope marker in one of the following shop (list of our best dealer in Colorado hereunder). If you didn’t find it, we advise you to contact Black diamond to know where you can find this product.

Best regards,
The Beal Company

-----Message d'origine-----
De : Avery Nelson [mailto:xxxxx]
Envoyé : samedi 21 octobre 2006 04:29
À : Webmaster
Objet : middle-marking ropes

Hello,

I am curious what beal uses to middle-mark their ropes? I own one of your ropes, and the middle mark holds up fine; however, I have other ropes that I would like to safely middle-mark in a similar fashion.

Do you sell the middle-marking compound? If so, is it’s use proven to not affect the strength of the rope? Where can I buy it?

I know that black diamond (associated with BEAL) sells a rope marker at:
bdel.com/gear/rope_marker.php

Is this same marking compound you use, or a different one? If different, is it (or any other) acceptable to use on a beal rope?

Cheers!
Avery

Andrew Carson wrote:This info came from an article in either Climbing or R & I, a few years ago. It identified the following as acceptable rope marking pens: the Carter (brand) MARKS ALOT; the Sanford SHARPIE; the Binney Smith MAGIC MARKER. Bluewater used to sell a rope marking pen, also. Accurate info in the magazine article? I've used the Sharpie....

The issue with this is that the manufacturer may change the solvent used in the marker at any time. That could lead to unpredictable results, without testing. This risk is not present with a marker designed by and for the rope manufacturer.

Edit to add: Seems like this should relocated to the climbing gear forum.

I also use sharpies and never had any trouble.

Furthermore, if I know the rap is not a full rope length I tend to always place the center 1”- 24” on either side of the rap rings. My rational is that by doing this I don’t always kink the same part of the rope that is running through the rap ring(s). I have no scientific evidence or training that has told me to do this, but I just figure that constantly kinking the same part of the rope might cause damage. This is what happens when I have too much time to think at the rap stations. Again, I only do it when I know it is not a full rope length rap.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Sergio P wrote:I also use sharpies and never had any trouble.

I guess that's kind of like saying you don't wear your seatbelt and you never needed it (because you were never in an accident). However, if articles are destructively testing ropes with sharpie markings, that's different. My comment above, however, is one I have seen listed as stated by the marker manufacturers. Search on MP, SuperTopo, Rockclimbing, etc.

I'm out.

Good point Avery. I also think that a sharpie cost $2 and the rope marker costs only a few bucks more. So it is cheap insurance and peace of mind to have the right gear.

Thank you all very much for your input and time. There certainly are some considerations to be made. Mr. Stich was completely correct however in illustrating the death count attributed to rope handling negligence as compared to rope failure. The rope happens to be a beal product so i'll be contacting them.

A blanket warning was issued in 2002 by the UIAA.

Here's a summary by the Alpine Club of Canada. Note that Mammut found that the Beal pen caused rope weakening.

Richard Radcliffe wrote:A blanket warning was issued in 2002 by the UIAA. Here's a summary by the Alpine Club of Canada. Note that Mammut found that the Beal pen caused rope weakening.

Quoting from the Alpine Club of Canada report:

In the tests the ropes were marked and the marked area was placed at the orifice plate in the standard UIAA drop test...

Weakening of the rope occurs only if the marked area is loaded in the fall. How many times have you fallen and weighted the middle of the rope over a biner or an edge? Never? I see...

Don't worry about things that just aren't going to happen. Worry about rapping off the ends of the rope because you don't have it precisely centered on rappel.

My recommendation: spend the extra bucks and get a bi-pattern rope instead of dicking around with marking pens or dental floss. You'll never go back.

PMI says to use the Sharpie TEC marker
Link: pmirope.com/product/tec-rop…

Edelrid said this:

"You just can use an EDDING 3000. We tested it already and it isn´t damaging for the material.
 
Mit Schönem Gruß / Best Regards
 
Elisa
 
Vertrieb - Sales

EDELRID GmbH & Co. KG
Elisa Obert-Rauser
Achener Weg 66
88316 Isny im Allgäu
Germany
Tel. +49 (0) 7562 981-143
Fax +49 (0) 7562 981-100
E.Obert-Rauser@edelrid.de
www.edelrid.de"

Sharpie is available in North America. Edding 3000 is available in Europe. 

Is 12 years a new MP thread resurrection record?

And still the same truth:  Lotta guys have died from rapping off the end of their rope.  No guys have died from marking the middle with a sharpie...

Marc801 C wrote: Is 12 years a new MP thread resurrection record?

Are you still climbing on a figure-8? ;-)

+1 Beal Rope Maker

One bottle last forever. And it has stood the test of time like most good things .... like the figure 8. ;)

food dye?  beet juice?  for a dark colored rope - no guess as to what might work.  You could use a sewing needle and insert some dental floss threads to act as a marker.....much like tell-tails on sailboat rigging

Brett Gilmour wrote:

Are you still climbing on a figure-8? ;-)

Do you mean the knot or the belay/rap device?

Marc801 C wrote:

Do you mean the knot or the belay/rap device?

Funny answer. Reminded me of this commercial:

I have a BD rope that the middle mark was completely gone and emailed BD about it.  They said that the Beal marker was what they recommend.  I also asked them about an idea I had about using canned beet juice as it is all natural and they said that it was a good idea and that they saw no problems with it.  I used some beet juice from non pickled beets and it has been working great and is still there after a rope wash.