Anchor - on a scale of truck to YGD...
|
So, my partner wants to squeeze all of the length out of his cord anchor possible and thinks this is the answer: |
|
First impression, and go for it MP's, is that you lack redundancy in that: |
|
Perhaps I don't understand the intention of this experiment very well, but it seems like if the idea is to get as much length as possible, why wouldn't you just tie a figure 8 in each end of the chord, that would almost double the length? |
|
The cloves are fine and make the cord strands redundant. I don't really like the single fishermans, though. I've heard it can slip under load, although I haven't seen any testing on it. If he's really that concerned about the length of the cord, use a ring bend (same as a water knot but with cord) or, better yet, get a longer cord. |
|
IMO it isn't an anchor if it only has 1 point of failure. This is nothing more than a long sling tied to a single bolt / piece of gear. |
|
The OP's wording is a bit lacking but I believe he meant to suggest that the upper locker is supposed to represent a master point and that the cord pictured is his partners solution for extending said masterpoint over an edge. |
|
Sorry for the ambiguity. The upper biner is for clipping into the master point of an existing rap station to extend it. The distance is such that a 60m barely makes it and this gives a bit more comfort. |
|
Why are you using the rap ring for an anchor? Use the hangers and leave the rings open for rapping. |
|
No. |
|
If your partner pushes you when you are climbing, and that extra makes you get through that crux you want to give up on, great! |
|
There are no rap hangers it's fixed gear with a steel ring master and most folks either clip the ring or the cables. |
|
No, for the reasons I outlined above. |
|
Matt Westlake wrote:There are no rap hangers it's fixed gear with a steel ring master and most folks either clip the ring or the cables. I am well aware of many more standard alternatives and have equipment for my own setups. This is just a question of whether you would trust this setup or give your leader grief when you found out this is what you were about to lower from or have a TR party on.Look, I don't have decades of experience. So, set up shown, bugs me, just at a glance. I can't articulate reasons (lack of experience), but it is far enough from what I would expect, that it has to justify it's worth, rather than I need to prove it's unworthiness. Make any sense? My expectation is one of those other things you said you are well aware of. Something in here rubs your sensibilities wrong. If it can't be made clear, easily, quickly, logically, what it is that you aren't seeing that makes this setup fine and dandy, the setup is not fine and dandy, maybe not for anyone, but for sure not for you. People die when they second guess themselves. FWIW, my sorta noob self doesn't like it, at a glance, but I don't have enough to go on to tell you why. Clip into cables??? I would need: a) to be with someone I trusted very, very much, b) to have it explained to my satisfaction, or c) both, preferably. And someone who is patient and respectful. |
|
Without legs that are somewhat distant from each other the master point will swing whenever the climber moves L/R of plum line. This will cause rope to 'saw' over an edge during a fall as both legs are dragged laterally, under load, over possibly sharp features. |
|
1-10.... |
|
JK- wrote:1-10.... Maybe a 4.5. Probably fine, but not particularly well done or thought out. If I'm bailing off a multi-pitch and in mega-conserve-gear-mode it'll do. I've done much worse canyoneering (more than once... as have most people who do it lots). If I'm cragging, I'd never set up something like this. Eight-on-a-bight (or even better super eight) would do a much better job of isolating the strands. EOAB ?wouldn't use much more cord either. Doubling up biners is rarely a bad thing. AKA: It depends.This seems like a half & half answer. Try out an experiment. Get a shoe lace create that crap anchor and see if you can pull it to failure. Or cut one loop of the clove? . . . ( it is unlikely that one side of a clove hitch will fail but as a previous post spoke to) a weighted cord rubbing against the rock under tension is courting disaster. Why risk it? One thing is never really redundant... Two pieces of cord Two wraps in the DOUBLE fishermans... TWO 'bieners' in opposition . . . Stop climbing with this set up. Sure - it will likely be fine - until it isn't! Also- always tie a knot below your belay device after your climber is ten feet up. So that the rope won't slip through the device, dropping the climber. Pad sharp edges Spend 6 dollars on a second cord take this to a professional (split the cost of the guided day with "same partner") before you climb with out redundant anchors again. |
|
That looks like my anchor set up! |
|
Crushin' Prussian wrote:That looks like my anchor set up! Am I allowed to vote on this dubious anchor?N0 ! , you do not get to voice anymore of an opinion than . . . .: it is DUBIOUS mountainproject.com/v/redun… |
|
Yeah, I can't see any good reason to use that. As others mentioned, joining 2 tails requires at LEAST a double fisherman's. |
|
(Second post. First one - now deleted - was major brain-fart) |
|
Michael Schneider wrote: Also- always tie a knot below your belay device after your climber is ten feet up. So that the rope won't slip through the device, dropping the climber.Don't mean to derail this thread, but this is the first time I've ever read this. Michael, is this commonly taught? Will the forces of a high fall not be dangerous for the belayer in this case? Just wondering since I hadn't run into this before. Thanks. I guess you'd have to lock out the climber first to then do the knot below the belay device. |