Destinations for widely differing climbing abilties - US or International

Piedra parada, Argentina

How about she gets super serious from now until mid spring and by then she'll be leading 11-?

Totally possible in that time frame assuming average fitness.

JCM wrote: I could have fun on the single pitches for a week or two in Potrero. But what about on the really easy end of the spectrum? Is there two weeks worth of good 5.7-5.9 climbing? For the easy stuff, multi-pitch is fine.

In my experience the EPC grades are generally a bit soft. There should easily be a weeks worth, probably two or three at the 5.9/5.10- grade and lower. And, especially, on the long moderate multi-pitch climbs (which EPC is great for), there may be the occasional bit that goes at 10b/c, but if she doesn't mind aiding a move here or there, it would mean a day-length expedition of 7-10 pitches, or more. e.g. Yankee Clipper is 13 pitches with almost all the climbing in the 5.7-5.9 range, only occasional short sections in the low 10s (by EPC standards, hard 9 moves elsewhere), with a "bonus" final pitch of 5.12 that you could add to your day. :)

As a leader on the harder pitches, you can also help her out if you've just passed a harder section -- leave a long sling hanging off the next bolt as a grab handle, just in case.

I climb somewhere in the 5.9-5.10b range, depending on where you grade it (Gunks 5.6 :) -- and I have done three week-long trips to EPC, and still haven't run out of climbing to do.

Also, EPC is great for a winter trip -- that is the best time of year to be there.

If you can wait until Mid March, I'd say check our the Red or the New. Kalymnos would also be perfect around that time. Maybe Siurana?

Again, Potrero is great, with quality routes in the lower grade range. You have low angle slabs with huge holds and steep powerful tufa climbs. Great stuff, and extremely cheap to get and stay there.

Problem is, the good easy stuff is generally not near the quality 12s and 13s. You'd have to do days split between crags, especially if you want tufa. Also, the reputation for soft vacation grading is not entirely true, especially when you're looking at stuff above 5.10 and just about every Kurt Smith classic.

Thanks for the suggestions everyone. We were browsing plane tickets last night to get a sense of airfares, and saw a shockingly good deal on tickets to Monterrey. We pulled the trigger and bought them on the spot. Going to EPC! 2 weeks in February. I've been there before and have the guidebook, but of course am open to suggestions for favorite routes in the 5.7 to (soft) 5.10 range.

Might this be the fastest time in MP history between the vague "Where should I go?" post and buying international plane tickets? About 4 or 5 hours elapsed time.

Also, even though this winter trip is on lockdown now, we are always on the lookout for other places to visit in the future, so keep the suggestions coming! I'd love to go to the New someday... how is that for the 5.8-5.10a climber?

Red rock canyon

How has noone mentioned the red river gorge!?

BrianWS wrote: Problem is, the good easy stuff is generally not near the quality 12s and 13s. You'd have to do days split between crags, especially if you want tufa.

This isn't an issue for us, be it at Potrero or otherwise. Split days are our standard procedure anyway. I usually try to pick evening-shade projects, so we do her routes for the majority of the day, and I do a slow all-day warmup. Then when good conditions come in the evening I get to do my stuff. So spending the morning at Mota Wall, then walking up to Surf Bowl in the afternoon is fine.

Any suggestions for favorites in the 12+ to 13 range?

Is it possible to get her out on 5.9 face a lot and perhaps she'll progress to 5.10? That would open some more doors like Kalymnos and EPC.

-Kalymnos (Will exhaust 5.8-5.9 pretty fast but grades are pretty soft and there is a LOT of 6a (5.10a ish) face climbing, and it seems likely she would progress to 6a/b pretty quickly)
-EPC There are 5.8-5.9, but a LOT more in the 5.10a range, and ratings are kind of soft at that level.
-Red Rocks
-J tree (not so sure about 5.12-13)
-City of Rocks (likewise)

She will be climbing 5.10 in a year if she is climbing that much. :) Homestead or Tucson area may be a good place?

Surfer Rosa and its neighbors are outstanding (I hate pinching, but my partner had a blast). Weekend wall also has some stellar 12+/13 routes with no approach.

Mileski wall has Mr Big and other great vert 12/13 routes far away from the crowds, plus a few mellow lines in the sub 5.10 range.

By far, Outrage wall is the shit for hard sport at Portreo. Devil's Cabana boy climbs pitch after pitch of tufa and wild chandelier features. Fit For Life is another steep and outstanding mid 5.12. In between these two routes are a lineup of solid 12s and 13s (Habanero, Hurdy Gurdy, etc).

The only catch to outrage is that many of these climbs' best pitches are not from the ground. You'd need to be prepared to get your second up with you somehow, or engage in other shenanigans like bringing two ropes and sticking to the first two pitches only.

Oh, and to back up an earlier poster's comment - you can't beat the Red for amazing steep hard sport, often nestled among moderate routes. And the grading there is actually soft :)

October/November and Feb/March Red River Gorge is possible. Hell, I climbed every month last year here. December/January can be a bit more dicey/unreliable.

Plenty for everyone here. Muir Valley will certainly cater to your need, but there's lots more to do outside that.

redriverclimbing.com for the online guidebook.

In response to JCM's question about the New:

Bubba City and tons of recent development at the Meadow and Summersville area has made it a good spot for sub 5.10 sport climbing, not too far from stellar steep 12/13 routes. Split days here are easy.

The rest of the gorge is not beginner friendly in terms of bolted routes. Brining gear opens up tons of awesome 5.9-5.10 routes, but there is a dearth of truly moderate gear lines near high concentrations of good hard sport. Split days here are almost out of the question, unless you really, really like hiking.

I'm biased, but check out S. Arizona. I'm in a similar situation, SO is a 5.8 climber, I'm getting into 5.12. We can always find places around Tucson for both of us.

Specifically, in the S.AZ winter we have The Homestead (5.8-5.12+, beautiful steep limestone w/ some real tufas!), the Dry Canyon (5.10-5.14 steep Limestone), Mt Lemmon (endless 5.5 - 5.14 granite, emphasis on vertical crimping but huge variety), Cochise Stronghold (5.5-5.12+, granite somewhat similar to JTree. Lots of committing multipitch, but plenty of single pitch trad & sport as well, and arguably the best rock in the SW).

I say you could spend a week each camping & climbing at The Homestead and Cochise and you'd be pretty darn happy. Lemmon is suboptimal for extended camping - there are some good spots, but it can be hard to find/get them without a local. For the most part Lemmon is a day tripping area.

I'm not an expert, but you could probably also check out N. AZ, like Jack's Canyon (sport limestone) and Oak Creek (trad). AZ strip is mostly hard hard, I think. If you're into desert towers & sandstone, Sedona could be a good choice too.

Have fun!

Nick Henscheid wrote:I'm biased, but check out S. Arizona. I'm in a similar situation, SO is a 5.8 climber, I'm getting into 5.12. We can always find places around Tucson for both of us. Specifically, in the S.AZ winter we have The Homestead (5.8-5.12+, beautiful steep limestone w/ some real tufas!), the Dry Canyon (5.10-5.14 steep Limestone), Mt Lemmon (endless 5.5 - 5.14 granite, emphasis on vertical crimping but huge variety), Cochise Stronghold (5.5-5.12+, granite somewhat similar to JTree.

Thanks! Great suggestion. Southern Arizona sounds pretty ideal for a winter escape, plus flying down there would be cheap and easy. Homestead looks perfect; I hadn't realized that there was so much to choose from on both ends of the grade spectrum. I've never really had it on my radar because of the road situation, but it sounds like that is improved somewhat, and would be doable if we rented a small SUV? Otherwise sounds great. Maybe next winter.

Last time I was at the Homestead was late winter (Feb?), and the road had been repaired enough that we were able to do it in a Forester with some care. Similar SUV would certainly do fine. It's been a pretty heavy monsoon season though, so who knows...worst case you can camp at the bottom and hike the road - it adds about a mile to the approach so it's not the best, but the climbing is totally worth it.

Nick Henscheid wrote: worst case you can camp at the bottom and hike the road - it adds about a mile to the approach so it's not the best, but the climbing is totally worth it.

A mile is all? That's NBD. I'll keep an eye on the MP comments next fall for road conditions if we're thinking about planning a trip down there. Homestead is now right at the top of the list for a 1-week winter trip in the US.

Yep, it's not bad - with the new Access Fund trail the hike from the highway is maybe 60-90 minutes max, depending on which wall you go to. Season starts around November, so someone will probably post a road update around then. Feel free to PM me if you head down, I'd be happy to show you around if I'm here, or put you in touch with someone else who can!

I realize you are looking at fabulous exotic trips, but you probably could both have fun at Hells Canyon, pretty simple trip from Seattle. Limestone, good for shoulder seasons, and lots of routes close together. Not much beta, so you can just eyeball stuff and climb together, and forget about the grades.