Modifying Haul Bag Setup: Putting the BD Gridlock to Good Use

Hi All,

I've been tinkering with my haul bag setup. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this new setup, using the features of the BD Gridlock.

Original Setup:

Modified Setup Using BD Gridlock (Note: I kept the left side using a normal lower locker, but I would convert all to Gridlocks),

The top gridlock maintains the orientation nicely and will avoid crossroading when hauling on the microtrax.



The two gridlocks coming off the bottom swivel also maintain the orientation in the opposite direction...again avoiding crossroading.

Also, when undocked, the docking tether (in this case on the right and it's yellow/purple mix) won't get jammed under the haul bag strap, the lower tethers, or the other haul strap's cinch line, even when slack...it's right there and accessible without futzing.



When docked, as simulated in the pic below, note how the one biner and the docking tether (right side, purple/yellow) are neatly oriented.



Okay, so that's my Sunday morning tinkering. What do you think?

PS. Not shown here is a safety haul line/biner. Omitted just for clarity of pics.

Cheers,

Jeff

I am utterly confused at what we're looking at here. Is this two side-by-side bags or do you have a chain of carabiners to each of the two haul bag straps on one bag? If the latter...why? I see two docking tethers but then I also see two additional ropes on each strap. What's going on here and why two docking tethers?What's a "safety haul line/biner?"

Maybe I'm a little dense, but it is really hard to see what you've done here (in both systems) and it all seems unnecessarily complex.

edit...OK, after looking a bit closer it looks like two side-by-side bags.

I see that you have two docking tethers. I've always used one docking tether for everything. Is there a benefit for two?

Two of the line I'm seeing look like the Hudon-method for attaching the second strap with a short section of cord, is that correct (the green and the yellow/black)?

What is the blue rope on the left and the white rope on the right? I think the white is just left-over haul line, but it looks like it's tied to something on the 2nd to bottom photo? An what are the two red/blue words on each bag?

Hmm, that docking tether looks like it could rip the gate off of the Gridlock if is gets loaded substantially.

Of course, I just read the tri-axial loading test from BD, so there is that, but still...

Hi Guys,

The white line is just a short piece of static that I used to suspend the system with the micro trax. Ignore that for all intents and purposes.

Yes this is set up with two side by side bags. Each with their own main locker. And yes I am using Mark's short strap 2:1 cinch system (yes those are yellow and green).

Each bag has its own docking tether. Blue for the left and yellow/purple mix for the right.

The other cords you see on the lower biners are lower tether cords for the ledge, shitter, etc.

The tethers inside the smaller gridlock area would never be weighted downward...only upward as they are the dedicated docking tethers.

Hope that sheds some light on. This. In reality it's the same setup that Mark has on his "all things haul bag" big wall tip sheet. Just with using gridlocks instead of normal open lockers.

Jeff Harmon wrote:Hi Guys, The white line is just a short piece of static that I used to suspend the system with the micro trax. Ignore that for all intents and purposes. Yes this is set up with two side by side bags. Each with their own main locker. And yes I am using Mark's short strap 2:1 cinch system (yes those are yellow and green). Each bag has its own docking tether. Blue for the left and yellow/purple mix for the right. The other cords you see on the lower biners are lower tether cords for the ledge, shitter, etc. The tethers inside the smaller gridlock area would never be weighted downward...only upward as they are the dedicated docking tethers. Hope that sheds some light on. This. In reality it's the same setup that Mark has on his "all things haul bag" big wall tip sheet. Just with using gridlocks instead of normal open lockers.

Thanks, that definitely helps to clarify things. Hopefully Mark will comment on this as well. Since it is essentially the same as his system I'd think it will work out just fine, although I'd still like to know the advantages to multiple docking tethers. I think trying it out will tell you if there are any potential problems.

Could the distance between the docking bolts complicate matters?

Hi,

Relative to docking bolts, not really. The tether cords are very long. So I can tether from waaaay far away from each other.

Best,

Jeff.

Ha! I HATE those biners, but I sort of like the idea.

For the top one, I use a DMM locking oval and have never had a cross loading problem.

The first biners down from the swivel are to give each bag a little bit of space to separate so getting into them is easier. They also give you OPTIONS (always try to have options in everything you do. Try to always have second way to do something (this is real good advice for life too, btw. Take it from a guy who lived a casual life and retired at 59)) in case you have to separate the bags. I never had them cross load so for me the Grdlocks there is no big deal.

I do like them for the bottom biner though. I use some giant, weird shape biners from Yates for that. I really like that they are giant but the do suffer cross loading every now and then and the haul straps and tether cords do get on top of each other. I try to always clip my tether cords to the outside of them so that they are easily pulled to the top when I dock my bags. Hmmm.....dang, I really do hate those biners....

I'm not really too concerned about biner failure due to cross loading though. I don't worry too much about "what if" situations. People create all sorts of odd situations that have a one in a million chance of happening, and then worry themselves sick about it. I guess if one of those biners were cross loaded and the bags got stuck under something and you hauled and hauled and hauled trying to un stick them, you might develope enough force to break the biner.

I use a docking cord on each bag and tie each to a different piece at the anchor so that the bags separate a bit and are easier to get into at belays and bivys. I also consider that the two docking cords are backing each other up. Also, each bag having its own docking cord gives you OPTIONS. For example, on The Right Side of El Cap Tower, the anchor on Lay Lady Ledge is on the extreme right end of the ledge. Its a crappy place to hang your ledge and the ledge is big enough, but not flat enough that you would want to leave stuff laying there not tied in. With my system, detaching one bag from the swivel is easy, moving it up the rope to a spot on the ledge with the Micro-Trax is easy, and then when I get it where I want it, the bag has its own docking cord, so I can dock it easily and quickly.

Mark Hudon wrote:Ha! I HATE those biners, but I sort of like the idea. For the top one, I use a DMM locking oval and have never had a cross loading problem. The first biners down from the swivel are to give each bag a little bit of space to separate so getting into them is easier. They also give you OPTIONS (always try to have options in everything you do. Try to always have second way to do something (this is real good advice for life too, btw. Take it from a guy who lived a casual life and retired at 59)) in case you have to separate the bags. I never had them cross load so for me the Grdlocks there is no big deal. I do like them for the bottom biner though. I use some giant, weird shape biners from Yates for that. I really like that they are giant but the do suffer cross loading every now and then and the haul straps and tether cords do get on top of each other. I try to always clip my tether cords to the outside of them so that they are easily pulled to the top when I dock my bags. Hmmm.....dang, I really do hate those biners.... I'm not really too concerned about biner failure due to cross loading though. I don't worry too much about "what if" situations. People create all sorts of odd situations that have a one in a million chance of happening, and then worry themselves sick about it. I guess if one of those biners were cross loaded and the bags got stuck under something and you hauled and hauled and hauled trying to un stick them, you might develope enough force to break the biner. I use a docking cord on each bag and tie each to a different piece at the anchor so that the bags separate a bit and are easier to get into at belays and bivys. I also consider that the two docking cords are backing each other up. Also, each bag having its own docking cord gives you OPTIONS. For example, on The Right Side of El Cap Tower, the anchor on Lay Lady Ledge is on the extreme right end of the ledge. Its a crappy place to hang your ledge and the ledge is big enough, but not flat enough that you would want to leave stuff laying there not tied in. With my system, detaching one bag from the swivel is easy, moving it up the rope to a spot on the ledge with the Micro-Trax is easy, and then when I get it where I want it, the bag has its own docking cord, so I can dock it easily and quickly.

Hi Mark,

Good stuff. Yes, the issue of cross loading whilst hauling didn't appear, at least to me, to be a major concern. While I was futzing, the issue of the straps getting on top of the tethers, and vice versa, the constant rotating around the lower biners to get things neat, that's really what I was thinking about when using the gridlocks (and yes, I agree, these things are a pain to set up).

The right side of this pic below is the one I love. The docking tether neatly sitting at the top, away from the other straps. Easy to grab, no futzing.

Yeah, keeping that docking cord free is the big feature.

csproul wrote: Thanks, that definitely helps to clarify things. Hopefully Mark will comment on this as well. Since it is essentially the same as his system I'd think it will work out just fine, although I'd still like to know the advantages to multiple docking tethers. I think trying it out will tell you if there are any potential problems.

Main advantage I see of 2 docking tethers is redundancy.

Stagg54 wrote: Main advantage I see of 2 docking tethers is redundancy.

If it made it easier, as Mark says, to get in and out of the bags or put them in different locations then I can see a real advantage. As far as redundancy goes, I don't really see this as a real issue since I use the haul line itself as a backup.

csproul wrote:If it made it easier, as Mark says, to get in and out of the bags or put them in different locations then I can see a real advantage. As far as redundancy goes, I don't really see this as a real issue since I use the haul line itself as a backup.

good point. For my own personal system I usually only carry one bag (I'm still a beginning wall climber and only do short walls at this time). I have one tether and a daisy. The bag rests on the tether and the daisy is the backup and provides a convenient place to clip stuff off as I take it out of the bag.

The main advantage of the two docking cords and attached to different bolts is that it separates the bags to allow easy access.
If you forget to unclip the daisy before releasing the bags, you're hosed. With dual tethers of my type, you can never, ever, hose yourself.

As far as redundancy goes, I'm not overly concerned, in over 400 pitches, I've never had one slip.

Let's not get all wound up in "my system is better than your system". These are great discussions because someone can learn, pick and choose, and maybe invent something better.
The best system is the system YOU like and works for YOU.

I've always attached my docking cord to the sewn loop at the base of the short haul bag strap (i think this loop is still standard on bags...) . This way when I dock the bag both haul straps are completely loose and the bags are really easy to get into. No need for a "haul strap cinch line." Am I missing some advantage of having the docking cord on the main haul bag biner?

Mark Hudon wrote:Let's not get all wound up in "my system is better than your system". These are great discussions because someone can learn, pick and choose, and maybe invent something better. The best system is the system YOU like and works for YOU.

agreed.

I tried that for a few pitches, Mikey, but it made my tether cords and all the haul bag attachment stuff hang down to far and get all clustered.

One thing I try and do is use twist lock carabiners for the bags. Screw gates seem to come undone.