Lowering rings vs steel biners

I was thinking of adding either stainless steel Fixe rings or plated steel Trango biners to the anchors of various local climbs.

Any thoughts as to the preferred option? The biners are actually a couple dollars cheaper and easier to use. They are plated though, but doesn't seem like mixed metals should be a real problem. Or am I mistaken about that?

Thanks in advance for comments.

I'd go with stainless quicklinks.

The sad truth is that people will take biners. Just takes that one person and all of your investment for the community is gone.

A quick link is a good way to make it removable, but not easy to get off without a wrench, so it would have to be premeditated.

Pete Spri wrote:I'd go with stainless quicklinks. The sad truth is that people will take biners. Just takes that one person and all of your investment for the community is gone. A quick link is a good way to make it removable, but not easy to get off without a wrench, so it would have to be premeditated.

+1

Pete Spri wrote:The sad truth is that people will take biners. Just takes that one person and all of your investment for the community is gone.

The Trango biners have a pin to lock them in place. You need a wrench to remove it I believe.

Use the plated biners.

1. They will wear out from rope friction long before corrosion is a question.

2. In the event of galvanic (mixed metals) corrosion, the plated biner will become the "sacrificial anode", meaning it will be the item that corrodes, not the plated hardware it is attached to. If you're worried about galvanic corrosion shortening the life of the biner, see #1.

Just to make it harder for you to decide, if you're maintaining worn gear (in CCC?) then the ASCA can donate either one you want - stainless rings or plated Mussy hooks (harder to clip than the Trango biners, but will last for a very long time since the rope pull surface is literally almost an inch thick - Trango biners all the way if it's a desperate clip though). We don't have plated rings, and we don't have stainless steel fixed biners. We also have stainless links in case you're swapping worn/rusted links (or webbing?).

This is assuming that local ethics are OK with open anchors, I know that some places have had biners/mussy hooks replaced with rings, and vice versa.

I had two very prominent members of the climbing community argue each side of that debate at the Future of Fixed Anchors 2 conference, one arguing that all (single pitch half rope length) sport anchors should be Mussy hooks to eliminate multiple steps from the belay chain for everyone (and reduce the number of fatalities that happen every year during the rethread process), and another that open anchors "dumb things down" and everyone should be forced to thread.

Personally I'm solidly on the open anchors side of things, but I'm biased since I did my first sport climbing in Owens (yep - back when they were all open cold shuts not Mussys). I actually really like Mussy hooks even on multipitch (yes, there are multipitch with them, at least in the Bishop area).

The links we have are 316ss (no one makes 304ss since most use of stainless links is maritime), the rings are either 316ss (Climbtech, very shiny) or 304ss (Fixe, duller color, less visual impact).

Mark, are you talking about these Trango biners?: trango.com/p-247-steel-wire…

These aren't cheaper than SS Fixe rings ($4.75 on Fixe website or Wilderness Exchange), but could be worth it. I for one love clipping biners on anchors, but I've been installing rings on new anchors simply for cost and theft prevention, as stated above.

By the way, anyone have a good source for mussy hooks? I like them, but never looked into purchasing.

evan h wrote:Mark, are you talking about these Trango biners?: trango.com/p-247-steel-wire… These aren't cheaper than SS Fixe rings ($4.75 on Fixe website or Wilderness Exchange), but could be worth it. I for one love clipping biners on anchors, but I've been installing rings on new anchors simply for cost and theft prevention, as stated above.

Yes, those are the biners.
Thanks for the reference to the Fixe site. Definitely cheaper rings than I was seeing on amazon. But still $3.50 for plated and $4.50 each for SS. Might be worth the extra $2 for the added convenience/safety.

I'd be mostly adding to existing chain anchors, not replacing worn anchors, so I doubt I'd meet ASCA requirements. Anyway, you guys have plenty of work to do and can make good use of all the equipment you have!

I'd use the steel biners. What we do locally here is Rings on routes that have a good stance at the anchor and biners on popular routes and on semi-popular routes without a good stance.

Mark, just a thought.

Winch hooks can be ordered for about $3.75 which in many cases is actually cheaper than the quick link you have to use. They also have a distinctly "not booty" vibe. It's pretty likely I would have found a way to steal biners when I was 19 and had never seen fixed lower offs before. It's best to equip not for the community but for the one young idiot who doesn't know better.

Winch Hooks

I couldn't find specs on them but most of the "not for overhead lifting" steel hooks are 7000# each. So yep, cheap hardware store junk that's stronger than the bolt they're attached to.

John Wilder wrote:Winch hooks = mussy hooks that Greg is referring to. They're really nice, super heavy, and rarely stolen due to their weight and not super friendly clipping feel. I love them for Red Rock. We've had a set on Caustic at Cannibal for a decade now and they're still going strong. Same for Yaak Crack at the Gallery (8 years). We occasionally use Dracos too (Fixe), which are really nice for anchors where the stances aren't awesome, so you want a quick clip.

If you google Mussy, you pretty much only come up with climbing discussions about them. Winch Hooks gets you into the retail end of the interwebs.

Gunkswest wrote:Also called an "Eye Hoist Hook," "Eye Sling Hook" or "Safety Hook." uscargocontrol.com/Rigging-… I found a great deal a few years ago from a Farm & Ranch supplier who had a close-out special: 30 winch hooks for $35.79 + tax + shipping. As someone else said, the quicklinks may well be more expensive than the hooks.

Just make sure to get the ones with the welded eye, not the pin! I've seen the pin ones on routes, and they are far less safe

highaltitudeflatulentexpulsion wrote:Mark, just a thought. Winch hooks can be ordered for about $3.75 which in many cases is actually cheaper than the quick link you have to use. They also have a distinctly "not booty" vibe. It's pretty likely I would have found a way to steal biners when I was 19 and had never seen fixed lower offs before. It's best to equip not for the community but for the one young idiot who doesn't know better. Winch Hooks I couldn't find specs on them but most of the "not for overhead lifting" steel hooks are 7000# each. So yep, cheap hardware store junk that's stronger than the bolt they're attached to.

Mussy's are a great idea.
In that case, is there any point getting stainless rapid links to attach them to the bolt hangers? Or could I go with cheaper plated links?

I think it's trendy to recommend only official climbing gear, rated, tested, and at least 316 steel. I can't say that's necessarily wrong, just way overkill.

I've seen a ton of plain ass quick links. Just like these $.94 bad boys and I've only seen them rusted to the point of being scary a time or two.

Even if they do rust, they don't spread that corrosion to the SS hanger. It's out in the open, dries fast, in Colorado, and is the sacrificial anode. Don't sweat it.

If you follow that link and the one I posted earlier, you can get the hardware for cheap.

Incidentally, if you like spending money, that site, E-rigging does have SS 316 quick links and winch hooks for really reasonable prices.

316 SS Mussy

316 SS Quick Link

Cool but way more than Clear Creek could ever hope to corrode.

Go with the trango biners. Waaaaaay easier to clip and i believe AAC members get a discount.

+1 For Mussy's or Biners - Open anchors eliminate the possibility for thread-through accidents & time wasted on rappelling.