Best Jobs for Climbers

Mar' Himmerich wrote:... It comes down to observing a subtle, continuous intent beyond words. If you have that, nothing will touch you— not even the possibility of burning out your fidelity to that passion in your heart.

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SteveF wrote:Are there any digital nomads on here?

'digital nomads' makes me think of instagram posts from people in thailand and bali

I used to be part of the rat race in NYC. In the past two years I have been able to combine traveling/climbing and remote working as a full-time software developer. My schedule is still somewhat structured, 40hours/week and I need to be online during the day for meetings and interactions with coworkers. I usually stay at a climbing town for 1-2 months then move on to the next one. So far Moab, Red Rock, Squamish lend themselves to be good bases. A couple of my climbing partners are doing the same.

vgw - Have you tried working from international climbing destinations like Thailand?

I would think the main appeal of being able to work remotely is that you can spend extended periods of time in places that are impractical to travel to for most people. I can climb in Moab for a long weekend, but I'd want at least 3 weeks off work to travel to Thailand.

I'll bet the main difficulty working internationally would be time zone differences and finding a reliable internet connection. Other issues?

doligo wrote: Wholeheartedly agree. I see a lot of old guys who've been guides and/or in construction in their younger years. Now they're broken, broke, but all they can do is manual labor so they could pay high premiums for Medicare supplements.

Is there something wrong with construction? I know Union guys that clear 60-80k in 6 months with a pension (that is a seasonal job). You can work as a contract welder,inspector,etc and clear $3-4K a week.

Your arguement is flawed based on the fact that there are just as many washed up bankrupt/divorced White collar workers who spent their days doing the same stuff that the construction worker you mention did (Coke, hooked and alcohol) instead of properly spending what they made and life accordingly

It is too easy. Climb first, work second. Live your life today. You do not need to the Lexus car and gated community, unless that is to your passion.

Ray Pinpillage wrote: The average lifespan of an American Male is 76. More than likely you'll spend more than 1/4 of your life retired...less if you're a dirtbag climber without a skill, trade, or work ethic.

Maybe you will, maybe you wont. If you climb now, you're 100% guaranteed that "climbing retirement" you want. If you do it later in life, there are zero guarantees. Not to mention, how well do you think you're going to be cranking on those RRG overhangs when you're 58? Do both. Find a sustainable job and climb. It doesent have to be one or the other.

There is nothing wrong with construction, but when you are 50 welding is not as easy as when you are 30. If you drop outto climb when you are young that is your choice, I would caution you that everyone gets old, and without a solid financial foundation old age in America is a very bad place to be.

PosiDave wrote: Is there something wrong with construction? I know Union guys that clear 60-80k in 6 months with a pension (that is a seasonal job). You can work as a contract welder,inspector,etc and clear $3-4K a week. Your arguement is flawed based on the fact that there are just as many washed up bankrupt/divorced White collar workers who spent their days doing the same stuff that the construction worker you mention did (Coke, hooked and alcohol) instead of properly spending what they made and life accordingly

Plus the blue collar types have figured out how to maintain their homes/boats/cars/gear without shelling out a bunch of money saved for retirement.

Personally it seems to me life is too short to spend ones life saving for retirement. If a person hasn't learned how to make money and save it by the time they are 50 they aren't very motivated or smart.

I prefer the balance of work and fun over full time work and strictly weekend warrioring with the occasional week or two off. Spending time at the crag on crowded weekends or even the gym on a weeknight isnt my thing.

I figure I can get on disability or welfare when I get old and broken. Go to work everybody I'm counting you paying your taxes!

SteveF wrote:vgw - Have you tried working from international climbing destinations like Thailand? I would think the main appeal of being able to work remotely is that you can spend extended periods of time in places that are impractical to travel to for most people. I can climb in Moab for a long weekend, but I'd want at least 3 weeks off work to travel to Thailand. I'll bet the main difficulty working internationally would be time zone differences and finding a reliable internet connection. Other issues?

I guess it's all depending on the nature of your work. You can be working from home/office and talk to no one or have to speak to a lot of people while you're remoting. Last year I tried to maintain some overlap with US East coast timezone during my 3 month trip in Japan. Definitely not easy.

Ray Pinpillage wrote: The average lifespan of an American Male is 76. More than likely you'll spend more than 1/4 of your life retired...less if you're a dirtbag climber without a skill, trade, or work ethic.

The average age of retirement for males in the US is 63. Not as significant a chunk of time as you think.

PosiDave wrote: Is there something wrong with construction? I know Union guys that clear 60-80k in 6 months with a pension (that is a seasonal job). You can work as a contract welder,inspector,etc and clear $3-4K a week. Your arguement is flawed based on the fact that there are just as many washed up bankrupt/divorced White collar workers who spent their days doing the same stuff that the construction worker you mention did (Coke, hooked and alcohol) instead of properly spending what they made and life accordingly

There is nothing wrong with construction if it pays you well and you get to eventually progress into managerial positions. The problem is, for example with welding that it is a very specialized highly-skilled and high-paying job, but it is very hard on your body. You eventually reach the age, when climbing hard and doing the job at the same time is not sustainable. And then there is a possibility of getting hurt while climbing. I'm not even talking about serious traumatic injuries, but just something trivial like a muscle tweak or some sprain could seriously affect your ability to do your job and earn money. If you choose to keep working, you risk getting a chronic condition that further affects your ability to work and climb.

Not all construction jobs are high-paying benefited, unionized gigs. In my area they pay $15-20/hr tops, no benefits. But say even if you got an associate degree in something, you could get a desk job that would pay you the same and leave you with enough energy to climb/train hard after work. And if you get hurt climbing, you can still do you job.

And your argument about white collar workers wasting their earnings and substance abusing is flawed. Anyone in any industry and in any income can make poor decisions and lead wasteful lifestyles. Even clergy.

Ray Pinpillage wrote: The average lifespan of an American Male is 76. More than likely you'll spend more than 1/4 of your life retired

Abel Jones wrote: The average age of retirement for males in the US is 63. Not as significant a chunk of time as you think.

Woo-hoo! A discussion about actuarial statistics. Right up my alley.

76 is the average male life expectancy at birth. That includes babies that die in infancy, teenagers that die in car accidents, etc.

If you're a male and you've just turned 63 then your expected lifespan is currently about 84 years. To run the numbers for other ages have a look at ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpect….

These are population averages, and they're based on currently-observed mortality rates. They don't allow for
- Potential future improvements in life expectancy
- Factors such as health, lifestyle, and family history. For example, rich people tend to live longer. See nyti.ms/1SzeIcm.

Finish carpentry. No not a carpenter from
Finland. Self employed. No schedule set your
Own hours 40 /hr minimum

Martin le Roux wrote: Woo-hoo! A discussion about actuarial statistics. Right up my alley. 76 is the average male life expectancy at birth. That includes babies that die in infancy, teenagers that die in car accidents, etc. If you're a male and you've just turned 63 then your expected lifespan is currently about 84 years. To run the numbers for other ages have a look at ssa.gov/planners/lifeexpect…. These are population averages, and they're based on currently-observed mortality rates. They don't allow for - Potential future improvements in life expectancy - Factors such as health, lifestyle, and family history. For example, rich people tend to live longer. See nyti.ms/1SzeIcm.

And the average age of retirement is artificially set by social security. If you live to be an old dirtbag you'll likely be an 80 year old food stamp recipient. Which, contrary to some other posts, will be about 20 years.

I personally would much prefer to spend more time climbing while I am young (currently 36) than just when I am in my 60's.

SteveF wrote: I'll bet the main difficulty working internationally would be time zone differences and finding a reliable internet connection...

I have a similar work setup as vgw although I'm on the product side not the eng side. I've done 3 weeks in the EU a few times. It's the perfect setup since you have most of the day to climb/explore while still putting in 8 hours in the late afternoon/evening.

Eric Carlos wrote:I personally would much prefer to spend more time climbing while I am young (currently 36) than just when I am in my 60's.

I don't think there is a discussion about work vs. climbing at what age, but rather about having a balanced profession/lifestyle in your physical prime and earning potential years (20s-40s) that would afford you to continue leading an active climbing life well beyond your 60s... Which is not that old, btw.

doligo wrote: I don't think there is a discussion about work vs. climbing at what age, but rather about having a balanced profession/lifestyle in your physical prime and earning potential years (20s-40s) that would afford you to continue leading an active climbing life well beyond your 60s... Which is not that old, btw.

climbing friend,

may you still maintain half-erection at age 60? Or would you continue the excessive limpening?

doligo wrote: There is nothing wrong with construction if it pays you well and you get to eventually progress into managerial positions. The problem is, for example with welding that it is a very specialized highly-skilled and high-paying job, but it is very hard on your body. You eventually reach the age, when climbing hard and doing the job at the same time is not sustainable. And then there is a possibility of getting hurt while climbing. I'm not even talking about serious traumatic injuries, but just something trivial like a muscle tweak or some sprain could seriously affect your ability to do your job and earn money. If you choose to keep working, you risk getting a chronic condition that further affects your ability to work and climb. Not all construction jobs are high-paying benefited, unionized gigs. In my area they pay $15-20/hr tops, no benefits. But say even if you got an associate degree in something, you could get a desk job that would pay you the same and leave you with enough energy to climb/train hard after work. And if you get hurt climbing, you can still do you job. And your argument about white collar workers wasting their earnings and substance abusing is flawed. Anyone in any industry and in any income can make poor decisions and lead wasteful lifestyles. Even clergy.

any welder worth a damn shouldn't be working for 15/hr. I don't know where you are from, but if you can welder 4G plate and 6G pipe (aka Being a skilled welder). It isn't hard on your body pending the work that you do (Shop welder)

If you are any sort of "skilled" blue collar worker, you would know what you are worth and know that for every 1 skilled worker there is 100 shit workers who don't want to take the time to know how to do shit. a "dirtbag" climber who can't cut crown moulding or have a license doesn't deserve $30-45/hr just like a Admin that cant keep up with technology will be replaced.

and the argument with white vs blue collar was that anyone can blow money and not plan for a future (Which you just agreed with)

If you have the skill in a trade, you will always be able to work and get paid accordingly. If you don't know shit, then you obviously are unskilled and deserve to get paid accordingly (in any field)

Try out a Union trade. Like boilermakers, pipe fitters, labors, carpenter, millwrights etc. I'm a boilermaker and I work about 6-8 months a year by choice and make around 60 to 80 thousand a year and the rest of the year draw unemployment. Anyone can get into one of these Unions by filling out an apprenticeship application. They will teach you everything about the trade without spending thousands of dollars at some college. You will get a pension and other annuity benefits and insurance. Boilermakers do a lot of powerhouse rigging, welding, and fabricating of boilers and pressure vessels. Rock climbers are usually pretty good riggers so this type of part type of work may be for you. I would love other climbers to join so if your interested I will give more info if you email me at alanmoles@ymail.com. Look into it!