Passive Gear Only Trad Rack

I know this has partly been covered in different threads but I'm curious how you would build a rack if you only used passive protection. What would it consist of? How many sets of stoppers and hexes etc...? Your favorite brands and sizes? I'd like to put a passive rack together that would get me through various multipitch routes. Thank you for the input.

I'm sure you've read enough MP threads at this point to know the first question you're going to get when asking about building a rack:

Where are you climbing?

Oops. Mostly climbing Southern California choss from Los Angeles to Santa Barbara but spending a significant amount of time on SoCal granite from LA to Sierra Eastside. I've followed on a bit of trad but as I build my own rack, I'm going to start passive and learn good placements as I slowly add cams.

cams are your friend, that being said, set of nuts, the DMM nuts are pretty great. The DMM hexes are also really good. I guess tricams can be active so they are off the table.

I guess if I really felt inclined to climb like this I would do a set of DMM nuts, a set of DMM offset nuts, and a set of hexes.

But seriously having BD .5-3 will make your life a lot more fun. IMO of course.

As long as you make a point to place both active and passive pro, I'm sure you would get proficient at both with no issue.

I did the same and started with BD stoppers and hexes, though I like the DMM Torque Nuts better than the BD hexes. Also offset stoppers are nice as a double set of stoppers. Tricams are a great addition also, cost a little more than a hex but open up more placement options. I only have black to blue for tricams, and I don't plan to get larger ones, but I do plan to carry them to compliment my cams.

I'm not the best source for your specific location, but IME nut wise DMM makes excellent stuff. On Eastside granite a set of DMM Offsets are phenomenal. DMM's Wallnuts are my favorite standard nut. Depending on the style (facey) and grade (harder) you're climbing you might want to pick up a set of DMM HB offsets. They looks small as hell, and people might tell you theyre aid gear, but when you slot a good one shits bomb. You'll probably want some tricams as well, though theyre not strictly static gear.

For bigger stuff you're probably looking at Hexes. I'm inexperienced here but I think most people go with either the DMM Torque Nuts or the Black Diamond Hexes. There are large tricams but generally are not well regarded.

Going all passive if fun, but also limiting. If you're trying to avoid buying cams, I'd get the DMM stuff already mentioned plus a set of tricams (not the really big stuff).

Mathias wrote:Going all passive if fun, but also limiting. If you're trying to avoid buying cams, I'd get the DMM stuff already mentioned plus a set of tricams (not the really big stuff).

Thanks for all the advice. Seems that DMM product is good solid quality and favorited. Smaller tri cams as well. I know I'll be limited but I feel it will be a good way to learn trad. I have experience plugging and cleaning cams so when the money comes for that I'll be well on my way.

1 set DMM offsets
1 set Camp tricams
BD hexes sizes 8-11
BD micro offsets size 2-6

Unwanted, but correct advice: Save up, get a set of cams when you can afford it, and climb with people who own full racks until you do. Keep your eye out for super deals (craigslist in CO is full of people getting rid of their cams) and snag them when they happen. All the hexes and tricams and other cheaper gizmos are just going to line the bottom of your gear bin in the long run.

The all-passive thing is best suited for people going ultralight in the alpine, experienced folks for fun, or people who like gear wankery more than climbing wankery.

If you absolutely must ignore this and you insist on wasting your time and money on crap that is terrible and you won't use more than a season because it sucks to use and doesn't protect all that well and you spend 6 musical hours on every pitch, DMM all the way. Torque nuts for the big stuff, HB offsets + Wallnuts is a killer combo for medium/small.

The Blueprint Part Dank wrote:1 set DMM offsets 1 set Camp tricams BD hexes sizes 8-11 BD micro offsets size 2-6

Pretty much exactly the info I was looking for. Thanks

shoo wrote:Unwanted, but correct advice: Save up, get a set of cams when you can afford it, and climb with people who own full racks until you do. Keep your eye out for super deals (craigslist in CO is full of people getting rid of their cams) and snag them when they happen. All the hexes and tricams and other cheaper gizmos are just going to line the bottom of your gear bin in the long run. The all-passive thing is best suited for people going ultralight in the alpine, experienced folks for fun, or people who like gear wankery more than climbing wankery. If you absolutely must ignore this and you insist on wasting your time and money on crap that is terrible and you won't use more than a season because it sucks to use and doesn't protect all that well and you spend 6 musical hours on every pitch, DMM all the way. Torque nuts for the big stuff, HB offsets + Wallnuts is a killer combo for medium/small.

Also great advice. Makes a lot of sense to go this route to get me climbing good hard Trad quickly.
I think I will stick to my original plan though. Climbing for me isn't so much about the hard push and physically testing myself. I enjoy it mostly for the experience of adventure and being outdoors, so I'm ok with filling the bottom of my bag with gear I'll end up passing on to others. A light alpine rack will be used for I plan on climbing long Sierra routes.

What about doubles in hexes and nuts? I feel I'll run into pitches where I'll need more than one of any given size. Would buying doubles be neccessary or should I stick to singles and buy a double in what ever size is recommended on any given route?

Buy cams instead of doubles in hexes

James Willis wrote:Buy cams instead of doubles in hexes

Got it! Because I'll eventually use mostly cams and the hexes will help to double those up when needed.

JoeGaribay wrote:What about doubles in hexes and nuts? I feel I'll run into pitches where I'll need more than one of any given size. Would buying doubles be neccessary or should I stick to singles and buy a double in what ever size is recommended on any given route?

Between end-wise hexes, sideways nuts, and passive Tricams, you'll effectively have triples in the all-important middle sizes. Double up only once you've gotten an idea what size cracks you're seeing too much of.

PS make sure you learn ALL the ways that hexes can be placed. They're not just "big nuts".

powhound84 wrote: If you do a full set of nuts, full set of hexes and some offsets, you will have doubles or even triples of the most common sizes. Just be careful about where you use your big stuff.

Right, thank you. Going to need the big stuff for when I really need it or anchor building.

Who cares what I have to say but huge shout out to the DMM offset nuts. Those new BD micro-nuts with the Hugh Banner shape look super cool too, haven't tried them though. The DMM offsets go where no other pro and there is also no need to get a set of regular nuts except for that fact that the DMMs are expensive for nuts, but I still want a second set.

Yeah, I have dmm offsets, walnuts, and brass hbs. Love em. But really, honestly, and truly don't try and limit yourself to passive gear. You say your climbing is about just being in nature and enjoying the experience: you won't enjoy it when your run out above a sketchy nut placement. Your life is on the line, and cams will make you safer.

Xocomil wrote:Yeah, I have dmm offsets, walnuts, and brass hbs. Love em. But really, honestly, and truly don't try and limit yourself to passive gear. You say your climbing is about just being in nature and enjoying the experience: you won't enjoy it when your run out above a sketchy nut placement. Your life is on the line, and cams will make you safer.

I trust your experience and recommendations as others have highly recommended the same. I'm not trying to go passive only for long. I will slowly build a rack of cams or buy in bulk when the time is right. For now I really do want to stay passive for a little bit and teach myself how to place passive pro quickly and efficiently. I just don't want to buy a bunch of cams and get lazy with learning passive placements. I also understand that following a good mentor is key to learning placements and I will not over look the importance of this.
Thank you for the info.

I don't think having cams will stop you from being good at placing passive pro. You WILL encounter climbs that require mostly nuts to protect. But the opposite is also true: parallel cracks are best protected by cams, and you'd be doing yourself a disservice if you had to avoid these because of a lack of gear.
That being said, it seems like you are well informed, so go crazy and have fun. I know some great climbs up here in the tahoe region that take mostly (or all) passive gear, so let me know if you get to the area.