Ailefroide/Briancon Beta?

Hi all,

My family and I are planning on a trip this summer, thinking of heading to the Ailefroide area of the Ecrins/Alps from roughly mid-June to mid-August (supposedly decent weather and fewer crowds?). Ailefroide seems as though it has pretty liberally bolted routes of a wide range of grades on good granite in an Alpine setting, so that doesn't sound so bad. ("Tuolumne, but without the runouts" is how I've heard it described.) We're really looking for sport routes up to about 6a+/6b at a comfortable temperature in the summer with some interesting cultural adventures...we're not after full-on Alpine trad or mountaineering.

A few questions:
-It looks like Briancon is the nearest decent-sized town to Ailefroide. We have 2 kids (5 and 2) and were thinking of trying to rent a place there. Anybody have any experience with Briancon? Good place to find fun things to do (especially on foot) with little kids? Somewhere else that's better?
-Alternate destinations to Ailefroide that seem even better to you for what we're trying to do? Chamonix does not look like a good fit to me, frequently wet from my experience, and objectives way too big and intense for the purposes of this trip. The more coastal/Provence/Calanques kind of stuff looks mostly too hot in the summer, and with a lot of polished routes from what I've heard?
-Any experience with the (limestone) climbing right around Briancon?

Any guidance would be much appreciated!

Best,
David

Optimistic wrote:Anybody have any experience with Briancon? Good place to find fun things to do (especially on foot) with little kids? Somewhere else that's better? -Alternate destinations to Ailefroide that seem even better to you for what we're trying to do? Chamonix does not look like a good fit to me, frequently wet from my experience, and objectives way too big and intense for the purposes of this trip. The more coastal/Provence/Calanques kind of stuff looks mostly too hot in the summer, and with a lot of polished routes from what I've heard? -Any experience with the (limestone) climbing right around Briancon? Any guidance would be much appreciated! Best, David

Only driven through Briançon but looks like a fun hang! Big enough town (compared to Ailefroide).

Back towards La Grave there's gobs of roadside climbing too. Pretty much venues 360 from Briançon.

Calanque is closed to climbing in the summer (fire hazard) anyway.

Not too far from Grenoble too.

Great area!

Sharon and I have been around there a couple of times for various kinds of climbing (and also road-bicycling and other fun outdoor stuff).

Good chance we'll be there again this summer around the same period you're talking about.

Ailefroide granite - I did one famous multi-pitch 6b route (Apparatchik?). Seemed well-bolted. Slabby - interesting if you like that. Myself I prefer more featured granite with more positive edged (or cracks).

There's lots of other single-pitch (some multi-pitch) non-granite crags all around the Briancon region (get the 2015 guidebook bilingual with English). I have critical additional details for how to find some of them.

The key advantage of the Ailefroide crags is that there in close walking distance to pleasant _camping_, so if you're not camping, and you do not deeply love slabby granite, you might prefer the other crags.

Via Ferrata: Lots of them. All the ones I tried were worthwhile. A couple had interesting "free" climbing sections (with hands and feet directly on the rock, using the steel hardware only for protection, not aid. I've posted detailed descriptions to UKclimbing.com

Alpine rock - some great routes which I've done (also ice and mixed). Need to be choosy with the rock quality around there.

Road-biking around there is outstanding, botht the famous TdF mountain passes and just riding down the Durance River valley. We found a place that rented an E-bike for Sharon.
Other options are mountain-biking (with lift assistance) and canyoning, and hiking.

Briancon is a substantial city. So you're more looking for "decent-sized town", there are other good options.

Overall: Like the Dolomites but with usually better weather.

Ken

Brian in SLC wrote: Only driven through Briançon but looks like a fun hang! Big enough town (compared to Ailefroide). Back towards La Grave there's gobs of roadside climbing too. Pretty much venues 360 from Briançon. Calanque is closed to climbing in the summer (fire hazard) anyway. Not too far from Grenoble too. Great area!

Thanks Brian! Are you thinking Grenoble as a place to stay or as somewhere to climb? Or both?

Cheers,
David

kenr wrote:Sharon and I have been around there a couple of times for various kinds of climbing (and also road-bicycling and other fun outdoor stuff). Good chance we'll be there again this summer around the same period you're talking about. Ailefroide granite - I did one famous multi-pitch 6b route (Apparatchik?). Seemed well-bolted. Slabby - interesting if you like that. Myself I prefer more featured granite with more positive edged (or cracks). There's lots of other single-pitch (some multi-pitch) non-granite crags all around the Briancon region (get the 2015 guidebook bilingual with English). I have critical additional details for how to find some of them. The key advantage of the Ailefroide crags is that there in close walking distance to pleasant _camping_, so if you're not camping, and you do not deeply love slabby granite, you might prefer the other crags. Via Ferrata: Lots of them. All the ones I tried were worthwhile. A couple had interesting "free" climbing sections (with hands and feet directly on the rock, using the steel hardware only for protection, not aid. I've posted detailed descriptions to UKclimbing.com Alpine rock - some great routes which I've done (also ice and mixed). Need to be choosy with the rock quality around there. Road-biking around there is outstanding, botht the famous TdF mountain passes and just riding down the Durance River valley. We found a place that rented an E-bike for Sharon. Other options are mountain-biking (with lift assistance) and canyoning, and hiking. Briancon is a substantial city. So you're more looking for "decent-sized town", there are other good options. Overall: Like the Dolomites but with usually better weather. Ken

Thanks Ken!

I do in fact love slabby granite so all good there!

Definitely not camping...maybe next trip!

Psyched to hear about the VF, we really like those, hadn't known that was an option in that area.

Optimistic wrote:Grenoble as a place to stay or as somewhere to climb? Or both?

Actually this year Grenoble might _not_ be so close to the Briancon, because the main connector road was cut because a critical tunnel collapsed -- need to check the latest on construction status.

I'd be concerned about using Grenoble as July-Aug climbing base because of heat.

Good place to visit for big climbing _shopping_ opps, or for indoor climbing on a rainy day. (the indoor climbing around Briancon is not real great, need to check hours - but nice that it exists at all).

Even in the Briancon region, Sharon and I (and others) choose towns which are at higher altitude than the city of Briancon.

Ken

Optimistic wrote: Thanks Brian! Are you thinking Grenoble as a place to stay or as somewhere to climb? Or both? Cheers, David

I like the town, but, as kenr mentioned, might be (should be) toasty in the summer. Tons of climbing 360 degrees around town, though.

Could move up to the Vercors. Lans-en-Vercors or Villard-de-Lans would be a good base in the summer. Ton of stuff to do up there, great mountain biking, hiking, caves, cragging, peak bagging. Some great gite options for rental too.

I based out of La Grave for nearly a week on a trip. Nice spot and access to great terrain.

Some of the areas above Corps look interesting, but, I've only done one day of climbing there. Beauty area and less crowded methinks. Kinda north of Pic de Bure area. Wish I had more info...maybe kenr is familiar?

The area out of Grenoble in/towards the Chartreuse looks nice and would be cooler in the summer. Craggin' there, in the limited amount that I've done, was great. We didn't see any other climbers but it was fall mid week when we climbed there.

Wow, tons of food for thought there guys! Maybe have to split the trip in half... Vercors looks amazing as well...

I climbed there in July a few years back and the limestone alpine routes are amazing. Up high it was definitely not too hot. My Italian friend chose it because the weather is typically good. We camped but I am sure you could find a VRBO or Airbnb there.

Mark D. wrote:I climbed there in July a few years back and the limestone alpine routes are amazing. Up high it was definitely not too hot. My Italian friend chose it because the weather is typically good. We camped but I am sure you could find a VRBO or Airbnb there.

This was around ailefroide or one of the other areas mentioned? Is there limestone above the granite in ailefroide as well as below?

Optimistic wrote:Maybe have to split the trip in half... Vercors looks amazing as well...

Vercors is a mid-elevation plateau surrounded by valleys. The famous multi-pitch limestone climbing is Presles. Some deep gorges with canyoning. And
a rather fun easy ridge traverse, les Aretes du Gerbier -- perhaps some of these photos might suggest an outing for when your children get older.

The Briancon region is a big river valley surrounded by dramatic mountain peaks and smaller side-river valleys. Climbing on several different rock types.
Very pleasant atmosphere in late June / early July before the European fixed-vacation-period hordes arrive ... we're glad to be making reservations now.

Ken

Optimistic wrote:Is there limestone above the granite in ailefroide as well as below?

There is fractured (less slabby) granite on the high peaks of the Ecrins / Pelvoux mountain group (also in the Ecrins / Oisans group over on the west side) - some is fairly sound on selected routes.

. . (I don't know if there's also any climbable high limestone in those regions).

There are some high multi-pitch limestone routes in the Cerces mountain group which is NW from Briancon (but those are nowhere near Ailefroide).

Ken

Yeah I was with an Italian friend so he had the guidebook and knowledge of the area. I don't know exactly where we were in relation to briancon. We were mostly on limestone from my memory and some routes were quite long.

I have spent a lot of time in Briancon and the surrounding area. You should have no problem finding a place to stay there. Even though it is 4000' in the French Alps there are a number of big stores for supplies so you can get just about anything you need to cook and eat. Check out Serre Chevalier if you want a bit quieter environment and just 10km away(they used to hold a World Cup climbing competition there).

Probably the quickest way to get there is to fly into Nice and drive over the Col de la Bonnette(highest continuously paved road in Western Europe) and the Col du Vars. It should take you about 4-5 hours as it is twisty, turny(but very scenic) mountain roads.

BTW, Nice and the Cote d Azur is a nice place to hang out if you are not climbing.

PS - One of the tunnels on the D1091 which connects Grenoble/Bourg d'Oisans with Briancon (over the Col du Lauteret) is in bad shape and close to collapse so the road is closed somewhere above the turnoff to Les Deux Alpes. That makes that route not an option. You can go over the Col du Galibier to get from Briancon to Grenoble/Vercors. It is probably 4-5 hours by car, but very scenic.

I'm local.

avoid absolutely to stay in grenoble. It's dirty and noisy city. Vercors is a nice place but the rock is not as good, except in presles, but presles is too hot in summer.

Briançon area is clearly the best place (300 sun days/year), decent rock, granit or limestone, very pleasant atmosphere, also suitable for rafting, mountain or road biking,mountainering, camping ...

The guide book is "ecrin est" from Jean michel cambon, but there is no english translation. Climbing is generally closely bolted, needs mainly QD, 2*50 m rope is mandatory.

Cerce limestone is my favourite but tete d'aval (20 mn from ailefroide) is also great.
let me know for details
P

Bruce Hildenbrand wrote:Probably the quickest way to get there is to fly into Nice and drive over the Col de la Bonnette(highest continuously paved road in Western Europe) and the Col du Vars. It should take you about 4-5 hours as it is twisty, turny(but very scenic) mountain roads.

For USA visitors arriving in mid-June or later who can get a non-stop flight to Geneva airport GVA -- even with Grenoble-Briancon road closed, surely it's easier to arrive at GVA and drive (via Chambery or Albertville) over the Col du Galibier to reach Briancon. That's how Sharon and I did it last summer (no point including Grenoble in the itinerary).

. (There's also the possibility of getting a flight to Torino/Turin and driving much shorter+easier to Briancon over Montgenevre).

Col Bonnette / Restefond might be interesting driving in a car, but I was unimpressed with the views from my bicycle: Col du Galibier is way prettier.
. . btw arguably Col de la Bonnette is not a true col or pass: the real pass crossing is a dirt road far below to its west. The road was "contrived" as a tourist attraction.
. . btw when they discovered that Col de la Bonette was _not_ the highest, they built the little "Cime de la Bonnette" loop -- even more contrived -- in hopes of better attracting tourists in search of the "highest"). Anyway there are "dead end" up-and-back-the-same-way roads in Europe which go higher.
. . Therefore ... those in search of non-contrived "higher" asphalt roads might better consider including Col de l'Iseran with their Col du Galibier itinerary from GVA to Briancon.

Bruce Hildenbrand wrote:D1091 which connects Grenoble/Bourg d'Oisans with Briancon (over the Col du Lauteret) is in bad shape and close to collapse so the road is closed somewhere above the turnoff to Les Deux Alpes. That makes that route not an option.

This report suggests that they now have much shorter detour completed around the closed tunnel. Not sure if or when or how it will be open for general public motor vehicles (versus bicycles?), and not sure how long the waiting lines would be. I hope this new detour will enable the Marmottes event to again roll on its normal loop course in summer 2016.

Ken

Even travel from Milan wouldn't be too bad. If so, climbing on the way around Turin might be fun (Rocca Sbarua). Quicker than from Nice?

Geneva would work...I always try to factor in the cost of a rental car too. Seems like that option might be spendier?

If Geneva, isn't there a bunch of craggin' south of Annecy? I've seen a guidebook...looks gorgeous.

This thread has me thinkin' about a road trip to Europe (again!)...fun!

Hi, I’ve been to Ailefroide six times with my kids and several times without, and I’ve climbed most of the multipitch routes in the guidebook. Ailefroide itself is just below the tree line so is cold at night. The sun also sets early as the campsite is surrounded by mountains. One good thing is one can have a fire if camping, another is that there is a lot of space. One can also find partners easily and walk to the routes. However we find it much better to stay further down the valley where it is much warmer. The campsite in Les Vigneaux (Camping Campéole Les Vaudois) is fifteen minutes drive from Ailefroide if there is no traffic and you will be able to sit around of an evening drinking wine. They also have small cabins for hire, so no need to bring anything with you. Most importantly, they have a great swimming pool. There are also several properties in the village one could rent. When I was last there it was possible to use the campsite pool even if staying in the village (for a small fee). You would need to check if this is still true (the owner of any property will be able to tell you, or the campsite staff – who speak English). There will also be other English speaking families on the site as it is popular with Brits and Dutch.

I would suggest you do not stay in Briancon or Argentieres Les Bessee. It will be hot, noisy and full of people. The road through Argentieres Les Bessee is a main road.

The busiest time (which I strongly suggest you avoid) will be the first two weeks of August. The 15th is a public holiday, so turn up after that date, or earlier in the season.

There are many great walks in the area and some via ferrata. I have spent nights in the mountain huts with the kids when they were the age yours are (carrying the youngest on my back).

Food is expensive in the villages. So shop at the Ed supermarket as you enter Argentieres Les Bessee from Ailefroide.

If you drive from Ailefroide to Argentieres Les Bessee and turn south on the main road you will quickly come to a public swimming lake by the side of the road. This has peddle boats for the kids and the water is a lot warmer than in the hills.

French 5c-6b is just right for Ailefroide. Its main problem is that there is little in the way of longer hard climbs. There is harder single pitch stuff. There are also a series of single pitch limestone crags with 30min drive of AG. On the long granite slabs you will need two ropes to get down as the rap stations are 45m apart or thereabouts. There is a 250ft high sector on the other side of the river from the campsite Ailefroide which is used mainly by beginners and families. This is a very well bolted slab and has a good base area for the little ones to play whilst the adults climb. Above the campsite in Les Vigneaux there is a massive limestone face with routes up to 22 pitches. This is a little bit more adventurous than the slabs in Ailefroide.

Being France, hiring a guide is easy.

The area sells itself as the sunniest and driest part of the French Alps, and this seems to be true, as I’ve only had 2 days of rain.

If you need any more info, email me.

Enjoy.

Wow, thanks so much to everyone for all the insights, very much appreciated!