Moving - Analyzing the options.

Other than the big city part, Durango more than meet the criteria.

Here is a list of things that are fairly important.

Close proximity to year round climbing, sport, bouldering, then trad.
Durango has lots of good sport with everything from 5.6 to 5.13+, even more awesome bouldering, and East Animas keeps it rad, especially if you like trad. The closest crag is rarely more than 15 min from the house, and can be as little as a 2 min drive.

Good indoor training facility
The Rock Lounge is pretty good and the owner is the coach of multiple high school and college climbing teams, not to mention a local hardman and developer

Decent restaurant scene
Durango hosts the most restaurants per capita of any municipality in the nation. The food's fantastic and the micro-brews are even better

Climbing community that is inclusive (but not lines at the crag on a Wednesday like front rage)
Climbers in Durango are almost always friendly and you never have to wait in line if you don't want to (provided you can lead up to 5.10 sport or 5.8 trad)

Access to good food, farmers markets, etc
I personally know some of the farmers that sell at the local farmers market. I assure you that all of your hippy needs can be satisfied. Again, the food is freaking awesome. Check out Machos for super cheap quality mexican food. $5 for a fat foot long burrito that tastes pretty damn good.

Road trip distance (2-4 hours) to decent places
When it gets too cold for cragging in Durango you can either hit the slopes at Purg, Drive 2.5 hrs to the creek, or drive 3 hours to Moab. Within 6 hours, you get Zion, Front Range, Los Alamos, Flagstaff, and pretty darn close to Red Rocks. Not to mention the proximity to Ouray...

For skiing, there's the local resort, Purgatory, which also provides access to a good amount of side-country skiing and even more for snow-snowmobiling, not to mention a decent amount of backcountry around. If you're looking for some burly gnar backcountry, Silverton Mountain is only an hour or less away.

If you set your heart on Durango you won't be disappointed.

eli poss wrote:If you set your heart on Durango you won't be disappointed.

Eli, Thanks for the feedback.

An off the beaten path option is Rapid City, SD. Lots of great sport climbing on granite and limestone, some of which is basically in town. Lots of good bouldering on granite and sandstone, with some ok bouldering right in town. Its a smallish town(<100K people) with no traffic or air quality problems, and very cheap to live there aside from flights being expensive. I have no idea if there is a gym there or not - there wasn't when I was growing up there, but that was awhile ago. There usually aren't that many days in the winter that are totally unclimbable though. Crowds aren't a problem, and for being such an isolated small town there is a big and friendly climbing community with quite a few strong climbers.

There are two small ski resorts in the northern hills, but they aren't anything special. Really good x country skiing though. Mountain biking and fly fishing are great there too.

The restaurant/food scene is fantastic for the size/location - probably helps a lot being so tourist oriented.

The biggest downside is the relative isolation. Devils Tower is 2 hours away, Tensleep is about 4, Lander or Boulder are about 6 hours, and Salt Lake is about 10 hours. Denver is the closest city of any size, and it is a boring 6 hour drive away.

Andrew Gram wrote:The restaurant/food scene is fantastic for the size/location - probably helps a lot being so tourist oriented.

Eric the OP wrote:
"Decent restaurant scene"

I'm curious what that means. Are you wanting a decent assortment of good restaurants or are you looking for restaurants run by James Beard award winners, places where the exec has been named a Food & Wine Best New Chef, and there are Zagat-rated restaurants?
If it's the latter, then small cities like Durango and Rapid City aren't going to satisfy.

Marc801 wrote: Eric the OP wrote: "Decent restaurant scene" I'm curious what that means. Are you wanting a decent assortment of good restaurants or are you looking for restaurants run by James Beard award winners, places where the exec has been named a Food & Wine Best New Chef, and there are Zagat-rated restaurants? If it's the latter, then small cities like Durango and Rapid City aren't going to satisfy.

Although I enjoy fine dining occasionally, I can wait until I am traveling for that. But the restaurant scene in Junction is not what I would expect from a city this size. Probably was spoiled just a little in Boulder, but there are only a few restaurants in GJ that have been worthy of a repeat visit.

Prescott is sick, but mostly for multi-pitch trad climbing (granite mountain), and bouldering at Groom Creek. Not much sport climbing in town. As far as AZ goes with your parameters, Flag might be your best bet.

and theres also "boulder west" aka Truckee CA

Marc801 wrote: Eric the OP wrote: "Decent restaurant scene" I'm curious what that means. Are you wanting a decent assortment of good restaurants or are you looking for restaurants run by James Beard award winners, places where the exec has been named a Food & Wine Best New Chef, and there are Zagat-rated restaurants? If it's the latter, then small cities like Durango and Rapid City aren't going to satisfy.

Well, the old Corn Exchange in Rapid City certainly qualified before it closed - the owner was a James Beard semifinalist a few times, and had the deck stacked against her being in such a backwater. The best restaurants in Rapid City aren't quite as good as the very best places like Forage in SLC, but are as good as many of the better restaurants in Salt Lake City or Denver. The food scene in Rapid has changed drastically for the better in the last 10 years - I don't recognize it from when I grew up there in the 90s. Nothing like Grand Junction or St George.

I recently moved to Flagstaff and I absolutely love it. The climbing community is awesome and the gyms are really good (what they lack in sq. footage is made up for by the quality route setting). That said, I would not move here for the sport climbing (although some of it is really good). Get psyched on trad and this place ROCKS! Everything that J. Snyder said is on point; he knows Flag climbing as good as anybody. Coming from the Southeast, I think the sport/bouldering down there is a little more abundant/quality (though you would probably get sick of only climbing on sandstone, and it IS the south...). Overall, I'd say the climbing in/around Flag is WAY better because of all the rock types and areas in close proximity; also, the trad climbing is STELLAR. So far I've never had to deal with any significant crowds and some of the food is really good too (excellent grocery store options). I don't know of any where else I'd rather be... but, I'm not a big city person and I think Flagstaff is the perfect size so I am biased.

Andrew Gram wrote: Well, the old Corn Exchange in Rapid City certainly qualified before it closed - the owner was a James Beard semifinalist a few times, and had the deck stacked against her being in such a backwater. The best restaurants in Rapid City aren't quite as good as the very best places like Forage in SLC, but are as good as many of the better restaurants in Salt Lake City or Denver. The food scene in Rapid has changed drastically for the better in the last 10 years - I don't recognize it from when I grew up there in the 90s. Nothing like Grand Junction or St George.

Ah....Forage...miss that place.

Why you would choose Ogden over SLC:

-Ogden has miles of untapped rock. Quality varies, but lots of potential.
-Smog/inversion in Ogden is generally not as bad as SLC.
-Depending on where you live in SLC, immediate access to rock is better in Ogden. Can drive 45 to 60 minutes to LCC/BCC, but if you live in SLC, that drive is still probably 30 minutes, so I don't think of access to SLC crags as being that much better. However, I can be at the trailheads in Ogden in 5 minutes or less most of the time, and can walk to one of the biggest ones from my house. I can be bouldering in 20 minutes, walking from where I live. Less if driving.
-Snowboarding at Snowbasin and Powder Mountain. Cheaper than SLC for tickets, 30 minutes or less to drive, good terrain. Not too far from Park City either. Not as much backcountry terrain around Ogden, but waaay less people in the backcountry than SLC area.
-Crags aren't crowded.
-Very road tripable to lots of destinations.
-The Front in Ogden is a great bouldering gym, good training facility, and decent lead climbing spot. A drive down to SLC lets you use your membership on a massive new lead facility as well.

Why you would choose SLC over Ogden:

-More urban living can be had. To me, Ogden combines the annoying parts of a town with none of the advantages of a city. There's a big food desert in the middle of it, so I can't walk to get groceries and bus service is not that great. You can ride the train to SLC, but amenities like public transportation that I appreciate about cities aren't that great in Ogden.
-Food scene would leave you something to be desired. There's a seasonal farmer's market, there's a few nicer restaurants, a place or two to get craft beer, etc. However, if you eat out much you'll quickly start exhausting options.
-Better "scene" in SLC. There's definitely a nice community up here, but if you want a serious climber enclave, you'll want to be in SLC.
-A LOT more established rock routes.

Derek DeBruin wrote:-Snowboarding at Snowbasin and Powder Mountain. Cheaper than SLC for tickets, 30 minutes or less to drive, good terrain. Not too far from Park City either. Not as much backcountry terrain around Ogden, but waaay less people in the backcountry than SLC area.

However, elevation, aspect, and lake effect vastly increase and improve snowfall in the Cottonwood canyons (SLC). True, you can get untracked at Powder Mountain 3 days after a storm, but so often while we're skiing powder in LCC, PM has baked refrozen sludge, especially after February. Since the OP lived in SLC for a bit I'm sure he's aware of this.

Derek DeBruin wrote:-Food scene would leave you something to be desired. There's a seasonal farmer's market, there's a few nicer restaurants, a place or two to get craft beer, etc. However, if you eat out much you'll quickly start exhausting options.

Just to clarify, you're talking about Ogden in these sentences, yes?

Marc801 wrote: However, elevation, aspect, and lake effect vastly increase and improve snowfall in the Cottonwood canyons (SLC). True, you can get untracked at Powder Mountain 3 days after a storm, but so often while we're skiing powder in LCC, PM has baked refrozen sludge, especially after February. Since the OP lived in SLC for a bit I'm sure he's aware of this.

Sure, and I'm not sure how high snowboarding actually is on the priority list based on other responses, nor how much price point or proximity affects the decision to ski refrozen sludge versus powder. Not to mention the dreaded red snake.

Marc801 wrote:Just to clarify, you're talking about Ogden in these sentences, yes?

Indeed, I'm talking about Ogden. There's a couple places to eat, but it's definitely not what you'd find in SLC.

Any boarding in Utah is better than just about anything in CO. I have only boarded in the cottonwood canyons, so I can't speak for the snow towards Ogden. I just assumed a similar experience with slightly less crowds. It is a priority enough to keep me from moving to Chattanooga, but not the highest on the list.

Derek DeBruin wrote:The Front in Ogden is a great bouldering gym, good training facility, and decent lead climbing spot. A drive down to SLC lets you use your membership on a massive new lead facility as well.

I used to be a member of The Front SLC. Did they expand?

Eric Carlos wrote: I used to be a member of The Front SLC. Did they expand?

Yep. Brand new facility in SLC with lots of roped climbing.

It's true, Ogden doesn't get as much snow as the Cottonwoods, but I think in general it holds up alright. On the other hand, I'm a climber first, skier second, so take that with a grain of salt.

Eric Carlos wrote: I used to be a member of The Front SLC. Did they expand?

Yes, they now have an Ogden location.
Since you lived here there are a number of other new gyms - Momentum in Sandy and Millcreek and a bouldering-only facility in Lehi.

Any boarding in UT is better than just about anything in CO?

Are you one of those guys that gets mad at CO license plates at Indian Creek?

mediocre wrote: Any boarding in UT is better than just about anything in CO? Are you one of those guys that gets mad at CO license plates at Indian Creek?

I have Colorado plates and am more than fine with them going to IC because I am not the greatest fan of redundant crack climbs (I expect some flack for that comment). But Utah snow beats CO snow hands down.

Eric Carlos wrote:I have only boarded in the cottonwood canyons, so I can't speak for the snow towards Ogden. I just assumed a similar experience with slightly less crowds.

Base elevation @ Snowbasin: 6450'
top of most of the major lifts: ~8700'

Powder Mtn is even lower, with many SE thru SW aspects.

Snowbird base elevation: 8100'
top of Snowbird tram: 11000'

Our pre-xmas week storm dropped about 50" in the Cottonwoods. Snowbasin got around 20", Powder Mtn less.

Current base depth/season total:
Snowbasin: 53"/118"
Powder Mtn: 38"/94"
Alta: 49"/162"
Solitude: 49"/165"

Edit to add: don't misunderstand - I rather like Snowbasin and have had many enjoyable days there, but I buy my season pass at Alta. Powder Mtn has never really impressed me all that much except for the lack of crowds - but there's a reason for the lack of crowds.