Half ropes comparisons/reviews. (Petzl Paso in particular)

I have been able to gather tidbits here and there on threads re possibly recommended (mammut genesis) vs non-recommended (petzl dragonfly) half ropes, but there isn't much info here or elsewhere on the interwebs comparing many common half-ropes. Anybody having experience with Petzl Paso 7.7s care to share how they functioned in alpine, leading on halves, double rope raps, etc?
Also, not to imply it is an issue, but anybody think going under 8 mil is undesirable?
Thanks.

The 8mm Mammuts are great, I have them, can't remember what they are called.

Jay Eggleston wrote:The 8mm Mammuts are great, I have them, can't remember what they are called.

Pheonix, I have a set but havent had a chance to use them yet.

Hey, I have the Paso's. Light use so far but I've been very pleased with them. Use them for both rock and ice but mostly ice. The're light, seem to handle very well and seem to be holding up so far. The middle mark on the orange rope is wearing kind of quickly but that doesn't surprise me. I used them on an extremely extremely wet day for some early season ice and the dry treatment held up perfectly. You wouldn't have known they were sitting in running water. Only rapped on them a few times and everything went smoothly, no mess, no tangles. See notes below on rope size.

The size is a bit tricky. The belayer typically uses a DMM bugette, and the leader climbs with a micro jul. They haven't been fallen on but from testing the bugette seems to catch easier. Belaying two seconds using the Reverso is actually not recommended by Petzl (I asked), and in a few tests I noticed a bit of slipping when only one rope was weighted. Guide mode on the micro jul works perfectly and is my go too. Because of the size of the rope, and in combination with the slick dry coating, every Prussik cord I own and sterling hollow block didn't catch as well as I like. Luckily the micro jul has a very effective auto locking mode for rappelling, the other climbers get a fireman's. Definitely be prepared to upgrade to specific belay devices using these ropes.

In conclusion, haven't used the ropes much, but when I have it's been in rough conditions. They handle great for there size and I was impressed with the dry treatment. I can't comment on the durability at all, but from my expierence I would recommend them.

I've had the Sterling 7.8mm twin/half ropes and they have been amazing. Three years of service and I'm looking to replace them but they are still fine, no coreshots. Sometimes, I think they are a little too thin but their durability has been amazing. For alpine climbing and desert towers with long rappels, they are great. I don't know about the Paso, but haven't ever been super impressed with Petzl ropes - mostly because they always seem to come out short on rappels and fuzz out quick.

Max Forbes wrote: The size is a bit tricky. The belayer typically uses a DMM bugette, and the leader climbs with a micro jul. They haven't been fallen on but from testing the bugette seems to catch easier. Belaying two seconds using the Reverso is actually not recommended by Petzl (I asked), and in a few tests I noticed a bit of slipping when only one rope was weighted.

Thanks, Max. I set up the Paso with an ATC guide on guide mode and found a high friction locker that's normally annoying with normal sized ropes now fed smoothly, and importantly, actually autolocked. Found belaying on guide mode (due to low friction) with Petzl Attache locker, 7.7 rope is skinny enough to get each strand pushed sideways when tension was on the climber-side strand, and therefore the rope slipped rather than locking. (With 2 attache lockers, rope actually locked.) With belaying with a small, cheap BD Positron locker, rope actually locked. Normally, it was awkward and required force to take in slack to belay a second on guide mode with the little locker.

Max Forbes wrote:Hey, I have the Paso's. Light use so far but I've been very pleased with them. Use them for both rock and ice but mostly ice. The're light, seem to handle very well and seem to be holding up so far. The middle mark on the orange rope is wearing kind of quickly but that doesn't surprise me. I used them on an extremely extremely wet day for some early season ice and the dry treatment held up perfectly. You wouldn't have known they were sitting in running water. Only rapped on them a few times and everything went smoothly, no mess, no tangles. See notes below on rope size. The size is a bit tricky. The belayer typically uses a DMM bugette, and the leader climbs with a micro jul. They haven't been fallen on but from testing the bugette seems to catch easier. Belaying two seconds using the Reverso is actually not recommended by Petzl (I asked), and in a few tests I noticed a bit of slipping when only one rope was weighted. Guide mode on the micro jul works perfectly and is my go too. Because of the size of the rope, and in combination with the slick dry coating, every Prussik cord I own and sterling hollow block didn't catch as well as I like. Luckily the micro jul has a very effective auto locking mode for rappelling, the other climbers get a fireman's. Definitely be prepared to upgrade to specific belay devices using these ropes. In conclusion, haven't used the ropes much, but when I have it's been in rough conditions. They handle great for there size and I was impressed with the dry treatment. I can't comment on the durability at all, but from my expierence I would recommend them.

was that the old reverso?

the new reverso 4 petzl shows explicitly belaying 2 seconds in autoblock

Howard. wrote: Thanks, Max. I set up the Paso with an ATC guide on guide mode and found a high friction locker that's normally annoying with normal sized ropes now fed smoothly, and importantly, actually autolocked. Found belaying on guide mode (due to low friction) with Petzl Attache locker, 7.7 rope is skinny enough to get each strand pushed sideways when tension was on the climber-side strand, and therefore the rope slipped rather than locking. (With 2 attache lockers, rope actually locked.) With belaying with a small, cheap BD Positron locker, rope actually locked. Normally, it was awkward and required force to take in slack to belay a second on guide mode with the little locker.

the new petzls are made by edelrid which is known for supple slick ropes IME

7.7mm is at the very bottom for the recommended rope size for the ATC guide as twins ...

catching a big lead fall on one single strand in a half rope situation might be highly questionable with a single braking biner ... double biners might be in order

;)

Look at the sheath percentage carefully on the half ropes, if you want to use it for alpine rock with many moderate/windy/blocky terrain I'd go for at least 40% sheath thickness.

A friend tried using the 7.5 mammut "twilight" ropes for alpine rock this summer, after only a few routes the sheath was already taking a beating. They really seem more appropriate for mostly vertical ice.
I have the 8mm "phoenix" for some granite slab routes, granted they have been drug over less blocks, but they seem to be holding up much better. Looking at specs the two ropes would have about the same core diameter, that's all sheath making the difference.
If I were buying new half ropes I would actually prefer something stiffer and less supple for handling, it seems to be easier to get the phoenix tangled than a stiffer cord.

Another thing to think about, the smaller the rope the easier it is to cut when taught.......

I climbed on twlights over the summer for alpine rock. Can't beat the weight, but as previously stated by the end of the season they are near the end of their life. I got a great deal on them though so no regrets.

Planning on going with something in the 8mil range for next year.

I just bought some Trango amphibians (8.1) after using Mammut genesis for many years. Haven't used them much yet, but so far I like them. Nice balance between stiff and supple.

bearbreeder wrote: was that the old reverso? the new reverso 4 petzl shows explicitly belaying 2 seconds in autoblock the new petzls are made by edelrid which is known for supple slick ropes IME 7.7mm is at the very bottom for the recommended rope size for the ATC guide as twins ... catching a big lead fall on one single strand in a half rope situation might be highly questionable with a single braking biner ... double biners might be in order ;)

I wonder how a munter lead belay does with the Paso in comparison to say an ATC guide which isn't really meant for it.

I'm happy with my Mammut Phoenix (8mm). Seems like the right size for a compromise between light and durable, and still able to function within the specs of most devices. I also use them for snow and glacier travel, so I considered compatibility with the micro traxion and 5mm prusik cords when choosing them.

Anyone have experience with the Petzl Rumba 8.0mm?

I have a few climbs on my Beal Ice Line 8.1's and have been very impressed so far, but I'm a half-rope noob so ignore me. They feed smoothly and don't tangle nearly as much as I expected them to. Rappelling with the smaller Smart Alpine (7.5-9.5) is smooth and locks completely when needed. My partner uses an old ATC Guide and he hasn't had any control issues on rappel, but he did decide to use a third hand, something he doesn't do on bigger ropes. 

John Alcorn wrote: Anyone have experience with the Petzl Rumba 8.0mm?

My buddy has them with no complaints. I've only climbed with them once and they worked great. It was in snowy/rock conditions and they stayed dry and handled just fine. 

Thanks for the feedback everyone. After using 70m Mammut Genesis 8.5s for several years, I think I'm going to switch to 60m Rumbas.

I've got a set of BD 7.8mm half/twins.  I've so far used them with both a Reverso 4 and a Kong Gigi with no slippage.  YMMV with a different brand and slightly smaller though.  My only complaint is that they are wearing a bit where I tie my EDK for rapping but that is probably because I'm pulling raps on super rough granite slab on these things so far.  Hopefully I'll get to use them for alpine next summer.

bearbreeder wrote: Hey, I have the Paso's. Light use so far but I've been very pleased with them. Use them for both rock and ice but mostly ice. The're light, seem to handle very well and seem to be holding up so far. The middle mark on the orange rope is wearing kind of quickly but that doesn't surprise me. I used them on an extremely extremely wet day for some early season ice and the dry treatment held up perfectly. You wouldn't have known they were sitting in running water. Only rapped on them a few times and everything went smoothly, no mess, no tangles. See notes below on rope size. The size is a bit tricky. The belayer typically uses a DMM bugette, and the leader climbs with a micro jul. They haven't been fallen on but from testing the bugette seems to catch easier. Belaying two seconds using the Reverso is actually not recommended by Petzl (I asked), and in a few tests I noticed a bit of slipping when only one rope was weighted. Guide mode on the micro jul works perfectly and is my go too. Because of the size of the rope, and in combination with the slick dry coating, every Prussik cord I own and sterling hollow block didn't catch as well as I like. Luckily the micro jul has a very effective auto locking mode for rappelling, the other climbers get a fireman's. Definitely be prepared to upgrade to specific belay devices using these ropes. In conclusion, haven't used the ropes much, but when I have it's been in rough conditions. They handle great for there size and I was impressed with the dry treatment. I can't comment on the durability at all, but from my expierence I would recommend them. was that the old reverso? the new reverso 4 petzl shows explicitly belaying 2 seconds in autoblock  Thanks, Max. I set up the Paso with an ATC guide on guide mode and found a high friction locker that's normally annoying with normal sized ropes now fed smoothly, and importantly, actually autolocked. Found belaying on guide mode (due to low friction) with Petzl Attache locker, 7.7 rope is skinny enough to get each strand pushed sideways when tension was on the climber-side strand, and therefore the rope slipped rather than locking. (With 2 attache lockers, rope actually locked.) With belaying with a small, cheap BD Positron locker, rope actually locked. Normally, it was awkward and required force to take in slack to belay a second on guide mode with the little locker. the new petzls are made by edelrid which is known for supple slick ropes IME 7.7mm is at the very bottom for the recommended rope size for the ATC guide as twins ... catching a big lead fall on one single strand in a half rope situation might be highly questionable with a single braking biner ... double biners might be in order ;)

If you look carefully at the instructions you posted,it says not to belay two seconds with rope <8.6mm (less than 8.6mm).

Have you seen the new atc Alpine guide? It is speced to work with ropes down to 6.9 mm.

Jesus Christ. Someone quoted and replied to a bearbreeder post. The nostalgia is felt deep in my loins