Another Autoblock belay failure leading to serious hurt

Boulder Climber had his autoblock fail on him resulting in his partner "working" the Naked Edge nearly dying. Great Rock and Ice story: LINK

http://www.rockandice.com/climbing-accidents/climber-dropped-when-lowered-in-autoblock-mode

"In an e-mail, the leader described what happened next. “I clipped a carabiner through the hole in the bottom of the ATC-Guide, clipped a sling through that, and redirected the sling through a carabiner off one of the anchor bolts. It took a lot of pull to get the ATC-Guide to release, but when it did, my partner [started falling]. I grabbed the brake side of the rope, but that didn’t help. I just got burns on my hand. Eventually I let go in frustration. My partner stopped when he hit the ledge...."

Dayum. Congrats to the fella for surviving it.

So an "experienced climber" used his gear incorrectly and dropped his partner. No wonder he wishes to remain anonymous!

"[...] It took a lot of pull to get the ATC-Guide to release, but when it did, my partner [started falling]. I grabbed the brake side of the rope, [...]"

Not experienced in lowering while in the guide mode.

User malfunction/error.
Not much else to say.

Title should say "Autoblock belayer failure leading to serious hurt"

Sounds like he didn't even have his hand on the brake strand when he started lowering. Even in guide mode, it's still a tube device; you can lift up the brake strand to brake normally.

Also your link is broken, here's the article:
rockandice.com/climbing-acc…

Using gloves seems to me to be a good idea to give the belayer a "second bight at the apple" after making a belay error and realizing the rope is whizzing along.
It is a fair point to say say that a belayer should never make an error that would require gloves, and I agree with that. But people make mistakes.

Talk about a misleading title! - unless it's meant to mock the gri-gri failure posts that always seem to end up as user error.

IMO, if you are lowering someone on a guide-mode/autoblock type device, I consider it mandatory to back it up. Use a Munter or a friction hitch, or at the least re-direct the brake strand so you can pull down on it and not have to pull up. I do not consider it adequate to rely on being able to pull up on the brake strand to apply more friction. This is too awkward a position to apply the brakes.

BD and Petal both mandate a backup of some sort when lowering. The release is sudden and it's difficult to control lowering.

Since you can go hands-free pretty easily (figure-8 on a bight to backup the device) there's really no excuse for not taking the time to do a proper back-up. I usually do a Munter off my belay loop and use that to control the rate of descent.

Autoblock didn't fail, the belayer did.

"Eventually I let go in frustration"

That pretty much says it all right there. Owwweeiiii, my hands hurt! I'll just let my partner die...NBD.

sure it was the belayer's fault but you guys are missing the point that most people don't need an autobloc device and are better off with an atcxp or equivalent. adding a munter hitch isn't a back-up, it's the whole enchilada.you don't need a belay device at all.

i second the use of a good belay glove. I've been dropped in eldo before, belayer error with a gri gri. Had he worn gloves, I probably wouldn't have decked and scared the shit out of an innocent family casually strolling through the park that day. Belay gloves are awesome for lightweight belayers also( girls). Belay gloves are the antilock brakes of climbing, you stay in control even when things get a little out of control.

Another misleading forum title

With any device, if you are going to try and "defeat" the device, you better have it backed up somehow. Standard practice is to have a friction hitch connected to the brake strand clipped to the belayer. Quick, fast, easy, safe.

turd furgeson wrote:Belay gloves are the antilock brakes of climbing, you stay in control even when things get a little out of control.

No. Belay gloves are not a substitute for not losing control of the rope in the first place. Belay gloves might help, probably won't hurt, but they are not a guarantee that "you stay in control when things get out of control".

Would the belayer not just have to let go of the sling he used to lever the device? Why would the guide not stop the fall if you just let go of everything and it went back in to regular autoblock mode?

Cody Allen 1 wrote:Would the belayer not just have to let go of the sling he used to lever the device? Why would the guide not stop the fall if you just let go of everything and it went back in to regular autoblock mode?

Yes, I'd imagine it would, but by that time a lot of rope can pass through.

retitle.

I see nothing wrong with the tittle. It says "belay failure", as in the act of belaying, which is what this is. The belay certainly did fail. It does not say "belay device failure", which would be wrong.

Cody Allen 1 wrote:Would the belayer not just have to let go of the sling he used to lever the device? Why would the guide not stop the fall if you just let go of everything and it went back in to regular autoblock mode?

Not necessarily - it is the weight of the climber that rotates the device into "locked" position. If the rope is running freely, the device is not necessarily "feeling" the weight of the falling climber, so to speak. It may lock up again, it may not.

Em Cos wrote: No. Belay gloves are not a substitute for not losing control of the rope in the first place. Belay gloves might help, probably won't hurt, but they are not a guarantee that "you stay in control when things get out of control".

If we want to really go into the metaphor- I don't think he was saying belay gloves are definitive protection, rather they help you make the best of a bad situation. Like ABS. Ideally you will never need the gloves to help stop a rope. Ideally you will never need ABS to help stop your car. But mistakes happen.