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Andrology - chopped and retrobolted?

Original Post
ErikaNW · · Golden, CO · Joined Sep 2010 · Points: 410

Went up to Jurassic Park today to climb Andrology. Fortunately, we had seen on the route comments last night that it had been retrobolted, so it wasn't a complete and total shock... but yeah, it was still a shock.

The route is changed. Can someone (anyone?) please explain to me why the last bolt was chopped? The new line goes direct from the previously 6th (now 7th as a bolt has also been added) to the anchors - which ok, is really hard, thin face climbing (hard 12? NOT 11d/12a)- and perhaps makes sense as it is a more direct line. The original line had that cool traverse left to the last bolt, then back right to the anchors.

The new line is distinctly different. WHY chop the original line? Sure, place the new bolt for an alternate, harder finish, but this was a 4-star climb that has been significantly changed, so why not leave the original in place also? The line is different enough that it is no longer Andrology.

There has also been a bolt added between the previous 5th and 6th bolts, which I can somewhat understand. It did have huge runout and has gotten harder over the past few years with some holds in that part of the climb breaking. It is not as heady now - but also not as bold, which again, was part of Andrology. Yeah I know - look at my tick list and flame me - I don't lead this grade, so maybe I have no business even commenting on it. But my husband has been projecting this line and it is so disappointing to see it changed like this. The fall was long (believe me, I know - I've caught it several times) - but it was clean and safe.

We aren't really part of the Estes Park community - so maybe this was a decision that was made collectively by the people who live and climb there. Were the FA's consulted before making this change? I really have a hard time understanding this, so please enlighten me if there is some reason for chopping that bolt. The line's personality and aesthetics have dramatically changed.

FrankPS · · Atascadero, CA · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 276

Oh good - it's time for another bolt war/flamefest thread. Take your positions.

Kevin Pula · · Denver · Joined May 2012 · Points: 20

Were all the bolts chopped and replaced? That fall on the 5th bolt always scared the crap out of me cause it was big and all the rock right around the bolt felt really hollow, even if the bolt seems solid.

It may have changed the climb some but the last bolt is also after the crux (at least I thought it eased up by the time you got to that bolt) and the big falls. Much of the climb sounds like it is still intact.

I know that one of the climbing guide outfits in Estes does a lot of bolt work at Jurassic and general upkeep (all good things), but most of that is on easier climbs they use for clients. Not sure that they would mess with this climb.

Tyler Thompson · · Estes Park, CO · Joined Jan 2012 · Points: 15

Kevin, The climb was not rebolted by the company you're thinking of. It's not my business to say who did it. I agree that it has drastically changed the finish.

ErikaNW · · Golden, CO · Joined Sep 2010 · Points: 410

To be clear - I'm not against the addition of an ALTERNATE finish on this climb. It's actually kind of cool - but the fact remains the original line was chopped and the climb has changed drastically as a result. Anyone who has this classic climb on their tick list should be aware it is no longer the same climb.

The 4th bolt is actually the one in the hollow sounding section (the big fall was on the 5th bolt, pretty easy going between 4th and 5th bolts), but all the bolts on the route probably need a close inspection with some possible updating.

Frank - I see you have spent a lot of time climbing in this area. ;) Not really sure you have a dog in this fight. I'm not trying to start a bolting war thread - that isn't what this is about. But thanks for your contribution to the discussion anyway.

Tane Owens · · Las Vegas, NV · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 905

So you're telling me that the best 12- sport pitch in CO is gone? Bummer! I loved everything about that pitch, even the hollow uneasiness.

Jon Lachelt · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Feb 2007 · Points: 0

I agree Erika, it seems strange that someone would remove a previous bolt unless there was some objective problem with it.

I'll also be interested to try the new line, but I wish there were still the opportunity to push myself to make those heady moves through the previous line.

Jon H · · PC, UT · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 118

Shame that this was chopped and retro'ed. Pretty crappy all around. It didn't need any extra bolts. And it was great as an 11d/12a (I thought it definitely warranted a 12 grade as holds have broken over the past 3-5 years). The direct finish goes around 12d, I tried it once on TR.

Maybe someone wanted a harder line up at Jurassic?

ErikaNW · · Golden, CO · Joined Sep 2010 · Points: 410

Well.... I guess here's the answer to who did the retrobolting.

Eli - I'm pretty surprised you chopped the original line, I would have expected better from you given your reputation in the community. I think everyone agrees the direct finish is good, but the original line should have been left intact.

facebook.com/climbinglife.g…

Eli s FB post about retrobolting Andrology

BigB · · Red Rock, NV · Joined Feb 2015 · Points: 340

:popcorn:

Dankasaurus · · Lyons, CO · Joined Jul 2012 · Points: 85

I bet Climbing Puerto Rico has a shit ton of fun at the crags.

Jon Frisby · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2013 · Points: 270

Haha I wondered why this thing felt so hard!!!

Greg D · · Here · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 883

Eli go oops.

tbol · · CO · Joined Mar 2008 · Points: 1,177

It is too bad that this climb is totally different in character now. It used to be my favorite pitch in Estes. Why not just replace the existing bolts (awesome thing to do and very much appreciated) and add one for a direct finish? This would make two great climbs to do. I think Eli is a good dude, and I am not the most stringent person regarding climbing ethics, but man it seems like taking artistic license over a classic, and very well established route, is a tad bit of a transgression. I wonder if Bernard and the FA party gave their permission to change the route?

This is also a popular spot for beginners, and to me, sets a bad precedent for how our resources are managed as climbers. Oh well, it is certainly not the end of the world (people make mistakes), and I am sure the new version Andrology 2.0 is a good route regardless.

Garth Sundem · · Louisville, CO · Joined Jan 2011 · Points: 20

I was up there Saturday expecting 11d and was surprised when, at the 2nd bolt, folks were shouting up that it's now 12c (yikes!). That's pretty far outta my onsite league...but DAMN the finish is now SUPER rad! A big huck off two tiny crimps to a giant jug. Sweet! And I can't wait to get back up there and give it another burn.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Colorado
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