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Boulder Basin Campground/ Black Mtn Area threatened.

Original Post
Yanina Aldao · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2015 · Points: 0

Let's seriously talk about ethics. There has been complaints from the Forest Service about the loud partying after hs and campfires (that are not permited at this time) in the Boulder Basin campground Black Mountain area. World class Bouldering destination with amazing mind blowing campsites. Unfortunately due to the behaviour of certain groups of climbers/boulderers, the area might be at risk of being closed out.
People, I'm PISSED. I just opened an account in order to rant about it. We need to stress the ETHICS of climbing, because OBVIOUSLY, there are certain people out there, who need to be EDUCATED.
1. Carry in, carry out. Your trash does NOT stay in the frigging wilderness!!!!!
2. Respect other climbers and other campers . Do NOT Boulder over other people's frigging TENTS!!! Goddammit!!!!
3. NO CAMPFIRES ALLOWED MEANS NO GODAMM CAMPFIRES!!! We don't have the resources to go rescue you after we already told you.
4.Respect the wildlife. In general respect the area you are visiting. No selfies with snakes please. But if you happened to get bit by a Southern Pacific Rattle Snake and you die, I will be very happy. Darwin award to YOU!
5.Travel and camp on durable surfaces and do not build furniture or landscape the wilderness. Btw, bitches, we can see you...
6.No, don't take stuff back home, that includes that rattlesnake and found racks.
7. Plan ahead and prepare. I definitely need a separate chapter for this one. Honestly, if you don't know how to poop in the woods, just do me a favor and STAY AT THE GYM!!!!

Tradiban · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2004 · Points: 11,610

Calm down. That nutty ranger blames the climbers for just about everything. It's probably not climbers at all.

Peace.

Travis Kaney · · Green Bay, WI · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 420

Woah...

on another note, just checking to see if anyone knows about the regulations regarding dogs at Boulder Basin Campground and the surrounding bouldering areas.

And before we get too worked up...
Yes, my dog is well behaved.
Yes, I am aware of leash requirements in the NF.
Yes, I clean up after my dog.

Gordy Schafer · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2011 · Points: 193

Yup, the ranger has it out for climbers. Yet there are some people acting a fool, climbers / non climbers alike. I've witnessed some pretty unfair treatment of users, & some punk a$$ behavior on the part of users. I haven't seen any rules posted, but I keep my dog leashed. The ranger likes my dog a lot.

RAZORsharp · · CA · Joined Nov 2010 · Points: 825

I agree with OP.

I really wish that book hadnt come out. Everything past the Boulder Basin campground was always empty. No one knew where Captains Junk was, nor the deep black sectors. The amount of trash and unscrubbed tick marks is unbelievable, let alone the illegal fire rings and tire tracks going down to Loh Roof.

Something needs to be done in terms of education.

The ranger does not have it out for anyone. If you pay your fees, dont have a fire and are respectful, he is quite a nice guy. Ive even invited him back to our site to have a beer and talk. Everyone has a bad day, and after finding cars not paid, trash everywhere and illegal fire rings in the high fire advisory season, you may be a little on edge when you come across a fat group of climbers.

Guy Keesee · · Moorpark, CA · Joined Mar 2008 · Points: 349

Sounds like all of you users who are in the know, need to start educating all of the climbers you meet out there.

Why get the useless Access Fund involved.... they don't give a rip about anything in California anyway.

Beau E. · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined Apr 2015 · Points: 1,656

I have been to Black about every other weekend over the summer, and most of the issues I have seen have been with families/couples who are there to camp, not climb (although I don't camp in Boulder Basin.) Most climbers know how to treat the places we love, and if you see some who don't, educate them.

matt c. · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 155

Would a clean up day help? I'm down to help and I fucking hate bouldering. Is the ranger really out to get climbers or are there enough shit-for-brains dumb-ass climbers out there to piss him/her off? I bet its the second.

It seems like a good time to be proactive about this stuff.

Choss Chasin' · · Torrance, CA · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 25

I saw mention of a book....did a guide come out for the area? If so then prepare for the shit storm that happened up at tram after that guide came out. I have been out of climbing for the last year with a shoulder injury but Black was one of the last bastions of bouldering "solitude", hopefully that isn't changing drastically.

lozo bozo · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2015 · Points: 30
Choss Chasin' wrote:I saw mention of a book....did a guide come out for the area?
Yep!

The death of black mountain
Rob Gordon · · Hollywood, CA · Joined Feb 2009 · Points: 115

I love the whole "it isn't climbers, climbers are responsible" argument. That may have been true years ago, but it isn't anymore. If anything climbers nowadays are increasingly the problem and feel like rules don't apply to them because they are on a mission from God to send their V12 one move lowball.

Gordy Schafer · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2011 · Points: 193

Certainly, some random chodes are going to Black Mt. & being foolish. Probably the same way they are showing up anywhere & everywhere being foolish. Some being climbers. The "usuals" are not. As to the guide book adding traffic, everyone wants it for themselves. I would drive past any other bouldering area to get to black mountain. Mainly because, even with the new guidebook, I can have entire areas of awesome rock to myself, on the busiest day of the year. It's not to hard to get away. I am friendly with the ranger, & You are right Adam, everyone has bad days etc, BUT I can say from personal experience that his preconceptions about climbers contributes to the problem. He puts people on the defensive with his accusatory tone. I've seen him make a very polite woman who made a simple mistake cry. Fact is, climbing is allowed. The attitude that we should beg for the right or feel ashamed of being there to boulder is wrong. I do agree, something does need to be done about education. I too take issue with the annoyance of tic marks. But most importantly, there needs to be clearly posted rules, & the distinction should be made that climbing IS NOT a problem. People are.

Guy Keesee · · Moorpark, CA · Joined Mar 2008 · Points: 349

GoBOY..... is this person named "Gary" ????? about 15 years ago we were doing a ton of roped climbing at the top of the tram, on Coffman Crag. This STATE OF CALIFORNIA RANGER "GARY" did not like climbers one bit.... when you got on the tram GARY would get on behind you and ride up. The moment you stepped off, he would demand that you surrendered your pack to a search.... No Beer, No Pot, No electric drill... the first time he found these on me he "let me off EZ... if I would ride down on the next tram"... In short the guy hated climbers... period.

So, we looked into the official status of Climbing at the top and found that it was sort of unclear... there is Tribal Land, State Wilderness Land and BLM Land.
Bottom line.... climbing was OK on Tribal and BLM land... State Land (wilderness) was local controlled. The only thing that was banned was POWER DRILLS. ......

So a good friend of mine and I went up there "CLEAN" except that we had Ropes and a rack.... When Gary confronted us at the top and tried to turn us around... My friend refused and dared Gary to arrest HIM.... of course he had no reason to arrest us so he didn't. Gary trailed us around all day and even instructed other Rangers to STOP us and to check our papers and detain us till Gary could catch up to us at the location. We ran that overweight POS around all day, all over all the trails and even down one of the steep canyons for about 1,000 vert, only to turn around and race him back up (we passed him on the uphill part)

My friend is one smart lawyer... he got the names of all of the other rangers who Gary told to stop us. He then wrote a very well written letter to Garys bosses, explaining just what happened to HIM that day. He included those names.... (so that there were other Rangers involved, this made it a mandatory investigation...)
Anyway.... Letters like these go into "THE PERSONNEL FILE" all state rangers have and these files get opened up at the "annual review".

My friend got us to write our own letters... none were as good as my friends but they did pile up in Garys File.

Bottom Line.... Gary was gone, off to someplace else.

Maybe he has returned? So get his name, know the dates he hassles you, get other Rangers names who are hassling you and write letters, lots of them.

That is how their system works... Rangers who get unfavorable letters get transferred or fired if a pattern exist.

Good luck

Gordy Schafer · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2011 · Points: 193

Guy, none of the rangers I have met are named Gary. Crazy story! Hopefully his threats he's been making about compromised access are only scare tactics. More than anything, I hope that everyone who goes to black mt pays the piddly 5$ fee, & follows the rules.

Guy Keesee · · Moorpark, CA · Joined Mar 2008 · Points: 349

GoBoy..... is the $5 for the adventure pass????

It's pretty EZ to comply with the rules.

Gordy Schafer · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2011 · Points: 193

Adventure pass is no good there. 15$ to camp, 5$ to park. Also, 5$ for additional vehicles in a campsite (seems to be an unwritten rule). That is the kind of confusion / ambiguity that has lead to conflict. I'm not complaining about the fees though, the road is being well maintained.

Joe Garibay · · Ventura, Ca · Joined Apr 2014 · Points: 86

I was up there last winter. Road wasn't bad but it did take me a few tries to get up the last little hill before campgrounds. I had some weight in my CRV. Would you say the road is better now?

hotdogcasserole · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2015 · Points: 375

Regarding the road: since the rainstorm at black in the middle of September, there is a rough patch that small cars can't get up...just an FYI. My truck does fine. As of last weekend, I ran into the ranger (John, I think) and he informed me that Boulder Basin was gated. Not sure if this is a seasonal shutdown.

The ranger has not been ticketing people for parking on the side next to the shitty spot, but he has made little comments like "I think it's funny that you think you can just park wherever you want on the road".

Regarding behavior of climbers on the mountain, I think it's a case of a few bad apples ruining it for the rest of us. For example, I was up there the first weekend in October bouldering, and the BB campsite seemed about 80% full of climbers. Then two dip-shits had a fire in the ring right next to Where Boneheads Dare...Several other sites spot-lighted them and booed, but they didn't put the fire out. I, being whiskey drunk, set out to confront them and tell them to put their fire out. They said that they were here all the time, they didn't think it was a big deal etc. etc. They had the mentality that Rob Gordon mentioned in his post: they were strong climbers that thought rules didn't apply to them because they probably boulder in double digits...This is the kind of attitude that drives me fucking nuts. I was unable to get these asshats to put their fire out and am lucky to have escaped their campfire without a physical altercation haha.

I guess my point is that we need to put pressure on people to do the right thing, especially when they are climbers that are threatening our climbing areas.

Rant over.

matt c. · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 155
hotdogcasserole wrote:Regarding the road: since the rainstorm at black in the middle of September, there is a rough patch that small cars can't get up...just an FYI. My truck does fine. As of last weekend, I ran into the ranger (John, I think) and he informed me that Boulder Basin was gated. Not sure if this is a seasonal shutdown. The ranger has not been ticketing people for parking on the side next to the shitty spot, but he has made little comments like "I think it's funny that you think you can just park wherever you want on the road". Regarding behavior of climbers on the mountain, I think it's a case of a few bad apples ruining it for the rest of us. For example, I was up there the first weekend in October bouldering, and the BB campsite seemed about 80% full of climbers. Then two dip-shits had a fire in the ring right next to Where Boneheads Dare...Several other sites spot-lighted them and booed, but they didn't put the fire out. I, being whiskey drunk, set out to confront them and tell them to put their fire out. They said that they were here all the time, they didn't think it was a big deal etc. etc. They had the mentality that Rob Gordon mentioned in his post: they were strong climbers that thought rules didn't apply to them because they probably boulder in double digits...This is the kind of attitude that drives me fucking nuts. I was unable to get these asshats to put their fire out and am lucky to have escaped their campfire without a physical altercation haha. I guess my point is that we need to put pressure on people to do the right thing, especially when they are climbers that are threatening our climbing areas. Rant over.
Thanks for doing this. I know its kinda a pain in the ass and really messes with your drunk but this level of accountability is to curb (although not stop) this shitty behavior.
Joe Garibay · · Ventura, Ca · Joined Apr 2014 · Points: 86

Toss a can of beans in the fire when they aren't looking?

matt c. · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 155

maybe next time, just open with pissing on their fire.
haha

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Southern California
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