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NO-FUSS MUSSY

Original Post
Ken Cangi · · Eldorado Springs, CO · Joined Jul 2005 · Points: 620

I've had the most convenience - without sacrificing confidence - in Mussys on anchor-bolts. From what I've witnessed in communication between climbers and belayers on sport routes, rapping is no bueno. Much easier to eventually replace worn-out Mussys than to deal with a climber decking because of miscommunication.

My experience has been that lowering from bolt anchors is safer than rapping, on several levels, especially when cleaning draws from steep routes.

Anchor rigged to keep tr from rubbing on links. The links could be replaced with Mussys.

Mussy set up to lower.

Mussy rig.

Jacob Koffler · · Las Vegas · Joined Jan 2014 · Points: 10

They're great huh

ze dirtbag · · Tahoe · Joined Jun 2012 · Points: 50
yep
Highlander · · Ouray, CO · Joined Apr 2008 · Points: 256

Yep,

Thats would I have doing around my local crags, adding mussys to anchors. For cragging they are great and in lots of cases cheaper than other ways of setting up an anchor and easy to replace.

Greg D · · Here · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 883

Sure they are nice and lowering is a better way to go at times.

But just for fun:
I'm always baffled when people associate communication issues with rapping. In complete absence of communication one still can safely rap. Merely a dialogue with oneself needs to transpire. Ok self. I'm gonna rap. Setup rappel. Rappel. Done. Even if your partner is rockin out with his earbuds, pbr and gri gri, you can still safely rappel.

I'm not trying to start another boring rap vs rappel debate. Both methods work and one method may be better than the other for the given situation. I do both depending. But I know the lowering nazi's are gonna flame. And I have a feeling who they will be.

john strand · · southern colo · Joined May 2008 · Points: 1,640

I can'thelp but have flashbacks to open shunts

Highlander · · Ouray, CO · Joined Apr 2008 · Points: 256
J Marsella wrote:What is the appropriate size of hooks to equip the anchors with? I love finding these things and I would be willing to haul some around with me and put them on routes I climb. Also, are clevis style hooks acceptable or are eye style hooks attached with quicklinks the way to go? I would feel good about lowering off of 2 beefy clevis type hooks but what about other folks?
No clevis style hooks, get the ones with the eye.
Ken Cangi · · Eldorado Springs, CO · Joined Jul 2005 · Points: 620
Greg D wrote:Sure they are nice and lowering is a better way to go at times. But just for fun: I'm always baffled when people associate communication issues with rapping. In complete absence of communication one still can safely rap. Merely a dialogue with oneself needs to transpire. Ok self. I'm gonna rap. Setup rappel. Rappel. Done. Even if your partner is rockin out with his earbuds, pbr and gri gri, you can still safely rappel. I'm not trying to start another boring rap vs rappel debate. Both methods work and one method may be better than the other for the given situation. I do both depending. But I know the lowering nazi's are gonna flame. And I have a feeling who they will be.
The communication issue isn't with rapping, per se. It's with the climber expecting the belayer to always have them on, while the belayer thinks the climber is rapping. I witnessed that exactly scenario, minus a tragedy, because there was time to point out the problem.
rocknice2 · · Montreal, QC · Joined Nov 2006 · Points: 3,847
KCP wrote: The communication issue isn't with rapping, per se. It's with the climber expecting the belayer to always have them on, while the belayer thinks the climber is rapping. I witnessed that exactly scenario, minus a tragedy, because there was time to point out the problem.
That's a huge communications issue.
That breaks the second rule of belaying. Don't take leader off belay until told to do so.

I've seen it many times on single pitch climbs. Leader gets to the anchor clips in and yells "Name, I'm good!"
Ken Cangi · · Eldorado Springs, CO · Joined Jul 2005 · Points: 620

Thank's, Dylan. That's exactly what I was saying. After 35 years in the sport, I no longer assume anyone's experience not to F up - myself included - and it's definitely happening now with more frequency. Lynn Hill and John Long blew their tie-ins, and John wrote the book. I'll bet he thought a lot about that concentration-lapse while recovering from his compound-fractured ankle. Point is that shit happens, and complicating the process for the purpose of preserving an easily-replaceable anchor is myopic.

I still climb at a high enough level that I spend a lot of time around twenty-something crushers with serious holes in their safety awareness. It reminds me of the difference in red vs black belts in Taekwondo. The red precedes the black. A red belt is understood to possess several of the technical skills of a black belt, although still lacks some important self-control. New climbers are putting down very hard routes in the gym before they ever tie in outdoors. The sum of their anchor experience is clipping Mussys or open cold-shuts at the tops of gym routes, without much thought. They eventually go outdoors believing that their gym skills equate to overall experience. I've witnessed this with my own young partners. They are oblivious to some hidden, albeit, potentially deadly hazards.

Rapping from sport anchors is mostly an American practice born out of an erroneous belief that preserving the longevity of anchors should supersede what many long-time climbers recognize as very important advantages of being lowered. I already mentioned cleaning steep routes, although there is more. The most important, imo, is that when a climber is never taken off belay during his or her ascent and descent, the opportunity to accidentally lean back onto an untethered rope is eliminated, avoiding a potential tragedy.

I'm not suggesting that dumbing down the process should replace solid communication and awareness. The most experienced climbers screw up, and the inexperienced do it alarmingly too often. That more outdoor-neophytes don't die is fortuitous. Adding sport-rapping to the mix unnecessarily opens a very dangerous can of worms. There's little value in it other than a bit less wear on easily-replaceable hardware.

sherb · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2012 · Points: 60
KCP wrote: Rapping from sport anchors is mostly an American practice born out of an erroneous belief that preserving the longevity of anchors should supersede what many long-time climbers recognize as very important advantages of being lowered. I already mentioned cleaning steep routes, although there is more. The most important, imo, is that when a climber is never taken off belay during his or her ascent and descent, the opportunity to accidentally lean back onto an untethered rope is eliminated, avoiding a potential tragedy. I'm not suggesting that dumbing down the process should replace solid communication and awareness. The most experienced climbers screw up, and the inexperienced do it alarmingly too often. That more outdoor-neophytes don't die is fortuitous. Adding sport-rapping to the mix unnecessarily opens a very dangerous can of worms. There's little value in it other than a bit less wear on easily-replaceable hardware.
Did not know that. I agree, I'm always slightly concerned that when my belayer and I agree on rapelling beforehand, that anything I yell -or the party next to me yells- will be misconstrued as "off belay." People are awful fast about taking me off belay.. what if I'm not at the anchors yet? Personally even when it is agreed that the climber will rappel beforehand I confirm, "are you rapelling?" before I take them off belay. No one seems to confirm that with me though, I suppose it does seem silly to ask that question when it was agreed on beforehand. Maybe I should be lowered from now on, but I'd be afraid of glowering looks from others.
Ken Cangi · · Eldorado Springs, CO · Joined Jul 2005 · Points: 620
Ana Tine wrote: Did not know that. I agree, I'm always slightly concerned that when my belayer and I agree on rapelling beforehand, that anything I yell -or the party next to me yells- will be misconstrued as "off belay." People are awful fast about taking me off belay.. what if I'm not at the anchors yet? Personally even when it is agreed that the climber will rappel beforehand I confirm, "are you rapelling?" before I take them off belay. No one seems to confirm that with me though, I suppose it does seem silly to ask that question when it was agreed on beforehand. Maybe I should be lowered from now on, but I'd be afraid of glowering looks from others.
Glowering looks pale in comparison to the look on the face of a climber who just dropped his or her partner because of miscommunication. Haters hate. That's what they do. Pay no attention to them.
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Fixed Hardware: Bolts & Anchors
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