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Crowd at Cox Hollow on 1/31/15

Original Post
Joshua Vanselow · · Bellingham, WA · Joined Oct 2014 · Points: 0

I'm a member of the Outdoor Adventure Club at UW-Platteville, and I just want to give everyone a heads up that we are having an ice climbing event at Gov Dodge state park this Saturday. We will have a group of about 25 novice climbers. We don't want to hog it, but it will take some time to get through all the climbers. I just don't want to ruin anyone's plans this weekend.

Michael Sullivan · · Boulder, CO · Joined Aug 2011 · Points: 745

Hey, thanks for the heads up!

James Schroeder · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined May 2002 · Points: 3,166

Thanks for the heads up, but 25, that seems a little excessive. Shouldn't a university "Outdoor Adventure Club" promote Leave No Trace principles?

Principle 1 - Plan ahead and prepare.

Bullet Point 4 -Visit in small groups when possible. Consider splitting larger groups into smaller groups.


Just sayin'

Doug Hemken · · Madison, WI · Joined Oct 2004 · Points: 13,668

Josh, thanks for the heads up. Keep in mind most folks are not on Mountain Project.

I hear through the grapevine that you've gotten some good, specific advice on breaking your group down into more manageable pieces. Things might be a little different if it was possible for other people to go over to Stephen's Falls, but not right now.

You should plan things so that other people who want to get some licks in will be able to. It doesn't have to be entirely convenient for them, but they should be able to "climb through." Not only is that the polite thing to do, but if you commandeer the entire resource of the Park for your group, you are in the zone where you need to get a permit (ahead of time), just like a commercial group.

chris tregge · · Madison WI · Joined May 2007 · Points: 11,036

I assume the park also knows about this. They charge a nominal fee (I think it's $50) for any type of "event" that occurs at the park. If you haven't signed up ahead of time they will find you and charge the $$.

Doug Hemken · · Madison, WI · Joined Oct 2004 · Points: 13,668

Chris, if you charge people for the specific event, you need a permit and you generally need proof of insurance.

The DNR tries not to worry about groups beyond that, it is kind of a gray area. Unless we want the DNR to begin managing climbers, we'll all keep group sizes polite and reasonable.

This is a touchy subject among climbers generally, which is why Josh tried to give folks a heads up, after all.

James Schroeder · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined May 2002 · Points: 3,166

Eggs, let me know when you cave, I'll happily lend you some gear for your first time...

Doug Hemken · · Madison, WI · Joined Oct 2004 · Points: 13,668

Money isn't the only catalyst, but it is the clearest one. Simply being a group representing an organization usually causes official ears to prick up, both in the WDNR and in the wider world of park and land managers.

No need to make it more complicated for them or us. We keep it simpler by making sure any group is ready to politely share the resource to some reasonable extent ... gray enough?

So you don't mind plopping yer sweaty body in the snow to shoot, but you balk at the idea of standing under a steady drip of ice water? I don't get it, Chris.

Timothy Labansky · · Wisconsin · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 0

Think all anyone is saying ,they don't mind climber's . But with a group of this size they are going to shred the ice, its a small area . And people who do like to ice climb some of who can only climb on weekends. May not get any climb time. Think we as climbers all welcome new climber's. We all started somewhere right ?

Gokul G · · Madison, WI · Joined May 2011 · Points: 1,753

Regarding the original post, I think Josh may have ended up making it look worse than it really is. They are planning to have 2 sessions with about 12-13 people (a morning group and an afternoon group). And each session will likely break down again into two groups of 6-7 (one group on ice, while the other goes for a hike/ski/something else) - especially if there are other parties that show up.

So there will be 25 people getting on the ice over the course of the day, and they plan to be there all through the day, but there will likely not be more than 6-7 people on the ice at any given time (and 3 ropes). Even so, that doesn't leave much room for another large party - maybe another group of up to 4 might be okay (albeit a little crowded).

Double J · · Sandy, UT · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 3,931

6 people on the ice at the same time with only three ropes? Gokul,I know i suck at math but I can't figgure out this algebraic equation.

James Schroeder · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined May 2002 · Points: 3,166
jon jugenheimer wrote:6 people on the ice at the same time with only three ropes? Gokul,I know i suck at math but I can't figgure out this algebraic equation.
#simulrapping
Doug Hemken · · Madison, WI · Joined Oct 2004 · Points: 13,668

Folks from SW Wisc solo routinely, like 50% of the time.

(Actually, Gokul does ....)

Gokul G · · Madison, WI · Joined May 2011 · Points: 1,753

Yeah, everyone solos, then they simulrap down! It's only a little more tricky with 7 people, but all you have to do is one simul-tandem-rap with the two lightest people in the group paired against the heaviest person. =)

James Schroeder · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined May 2002 · Points: 3,166

#solocal

Timothy Labansky · · Wisconsin · Joined Jul 2014 · Points: 0

So J for clarification purposes. Is that ,so local or going local ? Maybe hit a climb up tomorrow ?? Lone rock maybe ??

James Schroeder · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined May 2002 · Points: 3,166
Timothy Labansky wrote:So J for clarification purposes. Is that ,so local or going local ? Maybe hit a climb up tomorrow ?? Lone rock maybe ??
#solocal a combination of "solo" and "local" - defined as a local who regularly solos the routes in a given area, eg. Gokul at Cox Hollow.
Gokul G · · Madison, WI · Joined May 2011 · Points: 1,753

So I'm told that when Josh and the Platteville group arrived at Cox Hollow there was a group of over 20 from Indiana University occupying the crag. So the Platteville group made do with what there was at the Stephens Falls area.

Double J · · Sandy, UT · Joined Apr 2006 · Points: 3,931

Holy Fuck, WHY?!?!?

James Schroeder · · Fort Collins, CO · Joined May 2002 · Points: 3,166
jon jugenheimer wrote:Holy Fuck, WHY?!?!?
Because ice climbing is awesome!
Doug Hemken · · Madison, WI · Joined Oct 2004 · Points: 13,668

I'm so sorry, Josh.

Seems like Northern Illinois U also like to show up there.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Midwest
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