caving and canyoneering?
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just wondering how much overlab there is beteween climbing and caving and canyoneering. could an experienced climber go out and do these things at a high level right off the bat or is there additional stuff thats important to know? |
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I just recently started canyoneering after trad climbing for a few years. So I can tell you my experience. |
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An experienced climber will do fine at a "high level" of caving. Depending on the cave, you can expect a lot of talus type scrambling and plenty of crawling/squeezing in passages of every orientation. Ropework is mostly rappelling and jugging (learn the Frog!). |
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Jason Todd wrote:An experienced climber will do fine at a "high level" of caving. Depending on the cave, you can expect a lot of talus type scrambling and plenty of crawling/squeezing in passages of every orientation. Ropework is mostly rappelling and jugging (learn the Frog!). Things to keep in mind: -Access issues. All caves on FS land and some others have seasonal closures for bats. Decontamination procedures. Permits/keys.... -Dust mask. Seriously. You don't want to be breathing that radioactive hystoplasmosis infested dust in the crawls. -Heavier lid. Don't be using your Petzl Meteor for a caving helmet. -Knee pads. Anything will work. I used skate pads for years. -Piss bottle. LNT bro. -Pack. I like to use a briefcase shaped bag with a single strap. It seems like you are always fuckin with the pack and this makes it easy to push, pull, throw, move side to side. Again and again. -Eye drops feel good. Remember the dust mask. -Jolly Ranchers. The water seems to run low every trip and the JR's are killer for tricking your thirst. -Cavers take themselves way more serious than climbers. Crazy, I know. Most importantly: -Know how to navigate using the compass you brought. Have fun.Agreed. I would also add that it is a different environment. Everyone is claustrophobic to some degree (think not? Get buried alive in a coffin), so it is good to find out where you are on the spectrum. Claustrophobia can hit even experienced cavers, and when it hits me, I start babbling like an idiot or I sing Monty Python songs. Not pretty. Not pretty at all. |
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A lot of climbers take up canyoneering and the transference of skills is very easy (not including wet canyons). The most important new knowledge that climbers don't have is a knowledge of retrievable anchors. Retrievable anchors prevent the grooving associated with pulling ropes the way climbers do. This is of particular concern in soft sandstone typical of the Colorado Plateau - Moab, Arches, Canyonlands, San Rafael Swell, etc. Pulling ropes the way climbers do can create a groove tens of feet long and maybe a 1/2 deep in a single pull. There is enough concern on the part of the Arches staff to list grooving as a specific impact of canyoneering. PM me if you are interested in a resource on retrievable anchors. They are cool, fun and safe! |
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I've found that canyon anchors can be a little bit of a shock when starting out from a climbing background. Do not expect 2 or 3 bomber equalized pieces for each rappel (although there are canyons where this is the case) but instead anything from a small slung chock stone to a stack of rocks to your partner's body weight to whatever you're able to come up with! |
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Canyoneering does not share much of anything with climbing beyond the approach, rope and rappelling. Bolts are popping up next to or nearby natural anchors (natural anchors often judged to be unsafe or not even identified as anchors by climbers) such as meat anchors, chock stones, tiny arches (as small as two or three inches high/wide) and twigs. This is to the detriment to the sport. Hiking is just hiking, rappelling is just rappelling. The charm of canyoneering is neither of those. It the ghosting and creative anchor building that makes it interesting. Oh, and the truly awesome places you get to go to. I hope my point is well taken - don't be careless with canyoneering. It's too damn good. It's not a substitute nor a replacement for climbing. It's different. |
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Thanks for the informations guys, i guess i should buy some books on techniques before starting |
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Nate K, |
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I can only speak for caving and I find there is some overlap in technique between single rope technique and climbing but the gear is different since caves are abrasive, muddy and wet. In my opinion, the best thing to do would be to go to a local grotto meeting if your curious. Also, On rope by paget and smith is a great reference for srt in caves. |