Getting rid of Elvis "Shaky" Leg?

If you read my comment in its entirety, you'd have noticed I said 'if given the option, stand on your...'. Learning to be efficient with resting stances ( which includes standing on heels AND inside edges) does not equate to poor foot, etc, in fact, it's the contrary that is true. Not all hard routes are devoid of good resting stances, and not all easy routes are littered with ample rests. I can rattle off a list of routes 5.11 and harder that offer great FOOT rests, as well as awkward as f**k moderates that offer little in the way of crazy-good rests.

The only way to get rid of it is to climb something so far below your level that you really don't need protection.

The more you climb and the more comfortable you get in dangerous positions the less you will get it. But anytime you are questioning whether you are about to fall or not you can get it. It is all mental and really has nothing to do with how you are standing. On more than one route i have hit a crux and had to down climb to a spot to rest and get my mental state back before going up and pushing through the crux.

Anytime you get it try to find a solid foot (which may not really be a foot but could be any location where you feel solid enough to relax without thinking you will fall) to stand on rest and get some pro in so you can take the nerve off.

I think that Elvis Leg Syndrome, or ELS, is mostly genetic. From my understanding, one of the best ways to combat this issue is to walk a couple miles each week with ankle weights. This helps to get your stabilizer muscles ready for the stresses of climbing.

- Chaz Sochen

Shaking is about muscle fatigue, and the subject is exquisitely complex and subtle; have a look at icb.oxfordjournals.org/cont… for a readable overview.

The effects come from a combination of muscular and neuronal effects; it may not be possible to fully isolate either one in terms of how it effects the result. There may be genetic and gender differences as well; the subject really is quite complicated.

Some things known to affect the result are proper hydration/electrolyte balance and fatigue from previous activities. Proper breathing may have some effect; certainly the reflexive tendency to hold your breath during moments of strain will not help muscular endurance. These are things that you can at least partially control. Conditioning will also help of course. This requires time on less-than-vertical terrain. Real rock is going to be better than plastic, which doesn't provide an equivalent variety of foot positions. Overhanging climbing will at best be of minimal utility.

While actually climbing, anything you can do to lessen muscular fatigue goes under the heading of good technique. For footwork, the two components are (1) selecting less stressful positions whenever possible and (2) varying the load to the muscles.

Strategies for decreasing muscular stress involve adjusting the foot position and sometimes the body position as well. Lowering the heels and standing on the heels---whenever the rock makes these things possible---are standard techniques of very wide applicability. You have to be paying close attention to use these techniques. The opportunities are there on climbs of all levels of difficulty---watch videos of Adam Ondra on super hard overhanging sports routes and you'll see him using his heels from time to time, which is amazing considering the terrain seems as little suited to it as possible. The point is that you have to devote conscious mental awareness to the task of identifying and utilizing opportunities, and that better climbers see these opportunities where less competent climbers proclaim there are none.

Almost every climber has gotten themselves into some horrible stressful posture on a route, fought to get in some gear, and then having clipped it realized that a very minor adjustment in their body position makes everything far less tiring. Achieving the a level of awareness to detect the opportunities for resting that are actually there is a lifetime pursuit for climbers. You begin by consciously thinking about it as much as you can.

Strategies for varying the load to muscles also involve attention to foot position. Try not to climb exclusively on the insides of your feet; alternate between inside edge and outside edges as much as is practical. When standing in one spot to place gear, try to alternate foot positions rather than putting all the stress on posture, and try not to end up with all your weight on only one foot. Again, a conscious effort to distribute the loads is what matters. Such an effort starts immediately---don't wait until you are starting to feel tired, at which point you may already have lost the battle.

Actually, there is a third consideration of a more specialized nature. I don't know the physiology, but sometimes a shaking leg is related to the fact that it is in an extended position and has relatively little weight on it. Paradoxically, the shaking can be stopped by making an adjustment that allows more weight to be applied to the hold.

Finally, you may have to reconcile yourself to physical and genetic differences. I know people who never shake, whether they are in or out of shape, and others who end up vibrating no matter how much climbing they do and what mitigating techniques they employ. Personally, my susceptibility to shaking has declined with age, even though I don't climb as frequently and am nowhere near as strong in any body part as I was at my peak forty years ago. Some of the physical decline that comes with aging seems to have had a beneficial side-effect. Go figure.

i hadn't had elvis leg all year, since may. and i've been climbing harder and harder. i attributed it to being more comfortable on lead (i don't tope rope anymore, and i lead 3x as many pitches as i follow) and chinese adaptogenic herbs.

well, i got on a climb i had my doubts about the other day, and can't remember if i took my adaptogens, and bam. elvis was in the house.

i was on a flat ledge with my left inside foot flat and 100% on ledge, right was on a smaller hold. my wife said, why don't you shake it out. i just let it hang for a minute and did shake it out, this worked.

most climbs have rest stances where you can get the bulk of a foot or atleast transfer weight. use them.

most importantly, breathe and relax. i was scared for the first time in a while, mainly because i didn't trust my gear, then i blew a sequence and luckily got to a stance barely without falling, and that caused me to forget to do everything that has been working this year.

What's wrong with Elvis legging? It worked for the King.

You have to chuckle when you pull a crux, get to a decent stance and your legs, arms, and whole body starts vibrating in adrenaline exhilaration. You'd have to have pay a hospital bill to feel that kind of epi charge, I say enjoy it.

Colonel Mustard wrote:What's wrong with Elvis legging? It worked for the King. You have to chuckle when you pull a crux, get to a decent stance and your legs, arms, and whole body starts vibrating in adrenaline exhilaration. You'd have to have pay a hospital bill to feel that kind of epi charge, I say enjoy it.

The ol' shake and bake.

I've always called it sewing machine leg. Anyway, I used to think it was nerves. But then I realized it happens when my foot's in an uncomfortable position, like taking too high a step. Repositioning the foot is usually all it takes.

wendy weiss wrote:I've always called it sewing machine leg. Anyway, I used to think it was nerves. But then I realized it happens when my foot's in an uncomfortable position, like taking too high a step. Repositioning the foot is usually all it takes.

That is nerves =) If you are not in a comfortable stance you get it because you are not comfortable and it makes you nervous about falling. There are different things that cause it but it all goes back down to nerves. AKA not in a comfortable spot, tried from climbing to much, etc, high above last placement, risking ground falls from being runout etc, so you feel like you could fall / could get hurt.

I think it's simpler than that, Viper. I just bring the foot down a few inches, for example, and the shaking stops.

Simply breathe easy and stand on them heels. i used to get the same exact thing anytime i climbed but with that remedy all was well.

wendy weiss wrote:I think it's simpler than that, Viper. I just bring the foot down a few inches, for example, and the shaking stops.

Do you think about breathing all the time? You just do it. It is the same type of thing subconsciously you are nervous because of the position you are in. This may be due to the foot being up high and it is stressing your body in a way that is causing it to not like it and your body shakes.

ViperScale wrote: Do you think about breathing all the time? You just do it. It is the same type of thing subconsciously you are nervous because of the position you are in. This may be due to the foot being up high and it is stressing your body in a way that is causing it to not like it and your body shakes.

Most people don't think about breathing, but breathing properly is key to staying calm. People in panic attacks breathe well enough to not die but not well enough to (help) control the panic. You may not be in a state of panic, but low levels of fear definitely work to help make you shake.

ViperScale wrote: Do you think about breathing all the time? You just do it.

It is however something you have to train or remind yourself to do. Like when people start lifting weights and hold their breath while bench pressing (pass out much?), or stopping in the middle of the pitch and saying BREATHE to yourself.

haha caught myself plenty of times subconsciously holding my breath.

Thank you for all the tips. Couple thoughts since I posted.

1) I decided to try lots of steep hiking. I go out once a week to get a good work out and I think it helped a TON.
2) when I posted I was pushing my grade and was putting gear in when scared instead of going from stance to stance.
3) I noticed the uncomfortable harness attributed to getting stiff at long belays but not contributing to Elvis leg
4) still getting better technique but I think simple things like breathing, resting on big holds, dropping heels all made a difference.

Thanks again

I think it's mostly nerves / psychology ..... So just keep leading and get more confident, you will be fine.

Also- best and easiest advice is -- Swap feet. Shift around basically.

Read this and learn.

rgold
Aug 30, 2014
The traverse out to the Yellow Ridge on the Dogsti...
quote | flag Shaking is about muscle fatigue, and the subject is exquisitely complex and subtle; have a look at icb.oxfordjournals.org/content... for a readable overview.

The effects come from a combination of muscular and neuronal effects; it may not be possible to fully isolate either one in terms of how it effects the result. There may be genetic and gender differences as well; the subject really is quite complicated.

Some things known to affect the result are proper hydration/electrolyte balance and fatigue from previous activities. Proper breathing may have some effect; certainly the reflexive tendency to hold your breath during moments of strain will not help muscular endurance. These are things that you can at least partially control. Conditioning will also help of course. This requires time on less-than-vertical terrain. Real rock is going to be better than plastic, which doesn't provide an equivalent variety of foot positions. Overhanging climbing will at best be of minimal utility.

While actually climbing, anything you can do to lessen muscular fatigue goes under the heading of good technique. For footwork, the two components are (1) selecting less stressful positions whenever possible and (2) varying the load to the muscles.

Strategies for decreasing muscular stress involve adjusting the foot position and sometimes the body position as well. Lowering the heels and standing on the heels---whenever the rock makes these things possible---are standard techniques of very wide applicability. You have to be paying close attention to use these techniques. The opportunities are there on climbs of all levels of difficulty---watch videos of Adam Ondra on super hard overhanging sports routes and you'll see him using his heels from time to time, which is amazing considering the terrain seems as little suited to it as possible. The point is that you have to devote conscious mental awareness to the task of identifying and utilizing opportunities, and that better climbers see these opportunities where less competent climbers proclaim there are none.

Almost every climber has gotten themselves into some horrible stressful posture on a route, fought to get in some gear, and then having clipped it realized that a very minor adjustment in their body position makes everything far less tiring. Achieving the a level of awareness to detect the opportunities for resting that are actually there is a lifetime pursuit for climbers. You begin by consciously thinking about it as much as you can.

Strategies for varying the load to muscles also involve attention to foot position. Try not to climb exclusively on the insides of your feet; alternate between inside edge and outside edges as much as is practical. When standing in one spot to place gear, try to alternate foot positions rather than putting all the stress on posture, and try not to end up with all your weight on only one foot. Again, a conscious effort to distribute the loads is what matters. Such an effort starts immediately---don't wait until you are starting to feel tired, at which point you may already have lost the battle.

Actually, there is a third consideration of a more specialized nature. I don't know the physiology, but sometimes a shaking leg is related to the fact that it is in an extended position and has relatively little weight on it. Paradoxically, the shaking can be stopped by making an adjustment that allows more weight to be applied to the hold.

Finally, you may have to reconcile yourself to physical and genetic differences. I know people who never shake, whether they are in or out of shape, and others who end up vibrating no matter how much climbing they do and what mitigating techniques they employ. Personally, my susceptibility to shaking has declined with age, even though I don't climb as frequently and am nowhere near as strong in any body part as I was at my peak forty years ago. Some of the physical decline that comes with aging seems to have had a beneficial side-effect. Go figure. rgold
From Poughkeepsie, NY

Breathing & stretching exercises both just before the climb, and at home ( yoga classes?)will also help .

Yes, find better stances and all that. But your legs shake when they are tired. And I think it's pretty reasonable to expect your legs to be more tired than your partner's if you've played basketball earlier in the day! Nothing tires out the ol' calves quite like basketball.

What kind of shoes are you using? You might benefit from a stiffer shoe. A lot of people go for super soft shoes like Mythos or Moccasyms for trad, but you get more support on edges from stiffer shoes. I find that my feet have to work more in softer shoes (not necessarily a bad thing, but probably contributes to leg fatigue).

Sometimes i get allot of elvis leg when soloing not sure why, i would assume nerves or it might be that i change how i place my feet when soloing.