Hidden Valley, VA Access....again
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I start this topic every couple years and it inevitably goes nowhere but I thought I'd ask in case there have been any new developments. |
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Glad to see someone else interested in this place. A good friend of mine used to climb at Hidden Valley before it was closed. He may have even had a rudimentary guide to the routes (I'll have to ask to confirm.) He said it was some of the best sport he had done. We went over there in 2008 to try to get some more information but kept hitting dead ends as well. I would love to see this place opened up if possible. It's a great location for sure. Surely there are some more people that know some information about this place. |
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+1 for hidden valley access. |
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Jesco- |
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Hey gang - |
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Is there any way to get to the climbing without trespassing on private land? |
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I've been living in Abingdon for the past 4 years and would certainly love to see the place opened back up. I don't want to trespass on the man's land or in any other way deliberately piss him off, but if the cliff is on state land, he doesn't have a right to keep it to himself. If there are folks interested in organizing to try to resolve access, I'll gladly do what I can to help. If a survey is necessary, the Access Fund may be able to help with a loan or grant. Surveying the property boundary adjacent to the cliff shouldn't cost that much. I can try to get some estimates if someone can give me the location of the furthest climbs from the road. |
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People trashed the place, spray paint, shit on the trails etc and that is why is closed. |
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Excellent job dropping names and helping them to keep the place as they wish. If they wanted it open, it would be open. You obviously know them very well and respect their wishes. |
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After some discussion with a gentleman from the access fund, I've decided to remove my previous post. It sounds like the map I posted from the county GIS was off a bit, and potential legal access is more complicated than it looked. I was impressed by the amount of work they have already put into working out access for HV, and I'm hopeful they will get it worked out. So considering that, I won't be attempting to access any of the climbing there even if I can do it on state land, and I hope everyone else will refrain from doing anything to piss off the surrounding land owners. |
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Thanks amoses. The good news is there are ACTUAL discussions happening right now concerning access by several organizations. This has been a long time coming. Zappatista - I feel your pain. I hope everyone will keep their distance (whether you feel it to be fair or not) until there is some sort of finality to this process.....good or bad. |
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Heard over the weekend this issue may be getting close to being resolved.... The personal reasons this area was closed for has nothing to do with the area being trashed ..... Had to do with something more sinister... |
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How do you know for certain that the cliffs are not on his property? If you've got something that shows this it would be helpful to this process of getting access for everyone. |
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Although I hesitate to post and get called an "in person", since this is coming up again, I'll chime in. The cliff base and bottom access are privately owned by a number of people on 5 tracts of land that span the length of the cliff on both sides of the road. The upper part above the cliff is owned and managed by the State of Virginia (and requires a day use fee unless you have a hunting, boating or fishing permit in VA). This is all available in public land records. Given that hanging belays at HV are kind of silly, you would be trespassing if you were at the cliff currently. People who claim otherwise are simply incorrect. |
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Just a guess, but: Brian Payst wrote: This is all available in public land records. |
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I had previously posted and later deleted an image from the Washington Co GIS. The topo and satelite image overlay made it look like the state land border was just below the cliffline once you got beyond Jeanean's property. After some discussion with Brian, I learned that they have surveyed the property line and it is higher than it appears and the cliff crosses into several other properties. Public records tell you where the property lines are in relation to benchmarks, but you need a survey to know how they relate to the cliff. |
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It's private property, he could keep it closed forever if he wants to. That's just the nature of rock on private land, you don't have a right to trespass on someone's property to climb. I will say that things are moving in the right direction, more so than they have in the last 10 years and we're hoping to be able to make some announcements in the next couple of months if all goes well. |
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This is my soapbox moment for the day. I seriously hope people can stay off of private land while access is being worked out. People who trespass selfishly risk screwing up any chance that we'll all get to climb there someday. Those who are tempted to trespass and climb there anyway, DON'T. Those who are already trespassing there, please STOP. I know it sucks that we can't climb there but just because it exists doesn't make us entitled to access to it. It's private land, which has been verified by several parties, and it's the landowners' right to refuse or allow whatever access they choose. This doesn't just apply to Hidden Valley. Think about how what you do affects others, and maybe the landowners might do the same and realize they can open it up. |
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The problem arises when you have a property that is closed to climbing and there is not a chance of it opening again. That's when climbers take matters into their own hands. After ten years they have good reason to doubt it will ever open again. The same issue is about to start happening with roadside at the red. Except at the red they are making people pay a guide to climb. |
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No one (that I know) really cares if you go. Discreetly. The problem is bragging about it on the internet. That's stupid. |
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He's not being a dick. He closed it because someone took a dump at his registration box when the land was open. There's a rumor he's selling it to a friend of mine or possibly the access fund...so look forward to some changes. He spent his own money to bolt lines and you can do the same. Or better yet go put up some trad. There is lots of rock out there to be developed. Don't complain about access to private land at this mans place. He opened his heart years ago and got ripped off by people who didn't treat it with respect. If you're looking for similar sport lines to hidden valley go climb at the guest river gorge. |