Climbing an art to you?

Yes yes, life is art and all, just some of it is really ugly, pointless, and pretentious.

I think I hear the hum

To me most booty can be like a Picasso, its a beautiful sight from afar but sometimes when you get up close and really look at it it looks like that turd Sahalie described pinching off earlier.

Joshua,

Is it typical for you to create your own definitions of words and ignore the dictionary? I know politicians and advertisers have been doing this for some time but things sure get confusing if we are all talking about different stuff.

The idea that art is everything a human does makes the term art completely meaningless.

^yep

(sorry, for some reason the quote feature got messed up)

Joshua Jones wrote:

"I was surprised to read through three pages before encountering a definition of art. I appreciate the effort to define the word but I would have chosen this one straight from GOOGLE:

art / ärt/ noun: the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination."

I gave a definition on the first page. Art is hard to define; there are entire books, college classes, and a branch of philosophy devoted to the definition, and it's not as simple as just looking up a dictionary entry that turns out to be basically a tautology. What is creative skill and imagination? Is any construction project "art"?

MC poopypants,

I didn't create or ignore the definition of the word. Anybody who uses GOOGLE to define the word "art" will see that I used the definition supplied thereon word for word. What I did was eliminate the portion that isn't defining but is instead analogy or exemplary.

You must not have read my previous post which explains the use of the word "typically" as a reference word to exemplify, not actually define.

camhead,

I apologize, you did use the term definition on the first page. When I referenced a definition, I was referring a dictionary type reference and not an individual definition. Though, in truth individual perceptions are more relevant here that any dictionary term. I should have given more credit to your response especially since I lean more towards your perspective.

Most, if not all, personal definitions of art are going to be a tautology.

Anyone who has ever climbed with Locker has seen firsthand the pinnacle of the art of climbing.

J Q wrote:Climbing is more artistic when the gear is minimized.

Which is why bouldering is the ultimate expression of climbing movement.

Joshua,

No you did not use the definition word for word, you eliminated the part you didn't want to acknowledge. That part points to art being an intentional act to produce something for others.

Beauty is not art, it is beauty and it is specific to each individual. Painting a house is not art, unless the painter intends it to be. Otherwise it's just painting. Climbing with less gear is not art, it is climbing with less gear. The natural world is not art, it is god.

Seems like a pretty easy concept to understand but people are pretty clueless these days. Art is not an open term that everyone decides the meaning of for themselves. They can decide if they appreciate it or if it speaks to them or if it's beautiful or emotional but that's it.

Art is the result of someone creating art, and it is only truly art when it is inspired.

MC Poopypants wrote: That part points to art being an intentional act to produce something for others. Beauty is not art, it is beauty and it is specific to each individual. Painting a house is not art, unless the painter intends it to be.

By your definition, the only climbing art is climbing competitions.

MC Poopypants wrote: Art is not an open term that everyone decides the meaning of for themselves. .

Actually, yes it is. We as a society continually redefine every word every day through individual interaction. Thus, individuals very much do get to decide the meaning of words for themselves, especially abstract words like art, beauty, fun, etc.

If David poops for you intentionally in an artistic way, his shit is art.

Climbing with less gear is more entertaining and thus, is more artful.

Slow walks up a crack is not art. It is not exciting to watch or do. Most people claim this solitary pursuit as personal experience, so by your definition, chuffy trad climbs are not art.

Most climbing competitions are for entertainment and thus by your definition they are art.

I disagree with MC poopypants on various levels but will refrain from further banter with him as he fails to read the entirety of my posts.

I very much agree with Sir Chuffs alot. The idea that art must be intentional is ludicrous and would defeat the entire genre of abstract art which is usually art without intention.

The entire concept of art is individual. The ability for each of us to pick and choose what we independently appreciate artistically is what allows for such a wide range of artistic expression.

Climbing is artistic, at times, and I have witnessed many climbs and participated in many climbs that have inspired me to change, change myself related to climbing and change myself outside of climbing. These experiences have evoked emotion and appreciation for the display of skill, creation, creativity and determination of individuals.

Thus, climbing is an art, for me, maybe not for you. For me it is more of an art than painting, ballet, drama and many other forms of expression because it impacts me more.

Chuffs,

Not my definition, Merriam Webster and various artists I've listened to discuss this topic. You are way off base. When I think of the potential for artist expression in climbing I think of something like Salathe Wall where there was an intent to send a message to the community or maybe Blind Faith in Eldo.

I agree that how we understand language will always change but I think this idea that art is everything and everyone chooses what art is is the result of living in a culture that completely lacks any understanding of art. Not surpising as it is essentially non-existent in public schools and pop culture.

It is damaging to real artists because it de-legitimizes what they are doing. Real artists are underpaid and misunderstood in the mainstream.

Joshua,

Abstract art is most certainly intentionally created, that's not say the outcome was known in the beginning by the artist. I agree that we decide what we appreciate and respond to but that doesn't mean because it doesn't speak to you it's not art.

Climbing is artistic at times, agreed. But if you have a stronger emotional response to climbing than anything else you may be fairly shallow. Not trying to judge, though I just did, but seriously. How moved can you be climbing, it's vocabulary is pretty limited.

LOL

que dices güey?

Art engages my mind in a totally different way than climbing. Climbing is very analytic, high-alert and self-control oriented...very forebrain. Art for me is primarily emotional and reflective, an indulgence for when I am safe and my mind can relax, giving space for subconscious thought to process. They're wonderfully complimentary, but there doesn't seem much room for overlap.

climbing for me is a form of meditation

I have decided that MC poopypants doesn't understand basic English or he draws unreasonable inferences.

Nowhere did I state that "I have a stronger emotional response to climbing than anything else." I did say that climbing is more of an art to me than many things but the day many becomes everything is a sad day.

Dunno if climbing is art. But it sure is a passion. For me at least.