New (big!) gym opening in Golden - Earthtreks

Kai Huang wrote:I posted this on their FB page but somehow don't see it anymore. Anyways, I was checking out the upstairs hangboard area and was wondering if they would add pulley systems to each of the board and have weight plates upstairs as well. I don't think they would be excited to see people bringing weight plates from the workout room to upstairs. Oh, and clocks might be helpful too.

Great idea Kai, I second this :) Even if they just put eye bolts in, people could bring their own pulleys. If you want to know what the heck we're talking about, check out the "Installation" video here

Kai Huang wrote:I posted this on their FB page but somehow don't see it anymore. Anyways, I was checking out the upstairs hangboard area and was wondering if they would add pulley systems to each of the board and have weight plates upstairs as well. I don't think they would be excited to see people bringing weight plates from the workout room to upstairs. Oh, and clocks might be helpful too.

For that matter, a little footstool would probably be a good addition to that area too. My stubby little arms can't reach the upper half of any of the hangboards.

JCM wrote: For that matter, a little footstool would probably be a good addition to that area too. My stubby little arms can't reach the upper half of any of the hangboards.

Me too here. It was also on my wish list, but I figure I could probably grab one of those chairs and sit on too during rest period.

Sweet! Thanks Will, you guys are killing it!

Do you guys have any plans for the right half of the campus board?

Visited the gym for the first time today and was pleasantly surprised by the availability of routes and space on what I figured would be a busy Saturday morning/early afternoon. The girlfriend and I are both coming back from injuries and relegated ourselves to 5.9 routes and under but still had plenty of routes to choose from. The lead line testing was fast and easy(even though the extra top rope belay was annoying). I personally found the texture of the wall to provide a more realistic (like real rock) texture and made flagging and stemming far more useful than most gyms non textured walls. I was only able to try the small finger crack and found it a welcome challenge not found in most gyms. Definitely the best gym in the metro area by far.

I really like the new facility at the gym, and the staff have been super friendly. I think the place has a ton of potential.

I've noticed I trend I really don't like with the route setting though/ I feel like almost all of the routes have suffered from a serious lack of feet and that the feet they do have are far too large.

As a result, most of the climbing felt awkward and didn't flow well. I think the gym would much better replicate climbing outside if they set with more feet, and with smaller feet. When climbing outside, precise footwork can usually substitute for upper body pulling (certainly in the moderate grades), I think that should also be true for well set gym climbs.

Hi Christian (above)
I am curious as to what grade range you found that to be the case in?
usually route setters are best at setting routes within a specific band of difficulty, usually around their level +/- some number, and above/below that might not be as sensitive to the "flow" of someone at the level of the route.

I'd say it might be really constructive to be specific about the level at which you are having that experience and share it with the setters or with management and see if they can improve upon it.

Tony B wrote:Hi Christian (above) I am curious as to what grade range you found that to be the case in? usually route setters are best at setting routes within a specific band of difficulty, usually around their level +/- some number, and above/below that might not be as sensitive to the "flow" of someone at the level of the route. I'd say it might be really constructive to be specific about the level at which you are having that experience and share it with the setters or with management and see if they can improve upon it.

Hi Tony,

I'm recovering from a serious injury and have just been cleared to return to climbing. I'm mostly playing in the 5.7-5.10 range at the moment. I also though that maybe my experiences where limited to the easy routes set by stronger climbers. That said, I asked climbing partners who are climbing mostly 11s and 12s if the movement was better at those grades and they had very similar complaints.

I was kind of surprised I didn't see something like this on this thread before, since nearly everyone I talked to had the "lack of feet" complaint.

I do intend this to be constructive though. I'm really excited about the new gym.

Couple of thoughts- 1) Its a new facility, which means that the setters are still getting used to the walls, holds, and the community. Give them some time and definitely constructive feedback. 2) As a setter, I generally try never to mimic climbing outside (most setters I know dont, actually)- as it is extremely difficult to do well. The idea of flow, though, is super important for setting, and lots of feet for different body sizes/styles is usually a default setting for good setters. Nothing is more deflating to a setter than watching someone who cannot do a move you set because a foot is 4 inches too
low/high/etc.

Very good feedback. I've left a similar comment on thesendspot, so hopefully the management and setters can make some use of it.

I had a similar experience with a paucity of feet on 12's and 13's resulting in interrupted flow, thrutchy moves and dynos on the cruxes. And other people have expressed similar impressions at those grades. I emailed the owner through the Mountain Project Earth Treks link and he responded immediately indicating he would discuss these details with the head route setter. I imagine with the haste to open on time and get as many routes up as possible they probably didn't have time for the usual setting minutiae.

So email them these concerns and I bet they'll resolve pretty quickly.

Christian Mason wrote: Hi Tony, I'm recovering from a serious injury and have just been cleared to return to climbing. I'm mostly playing in the 5.7-5.10 range at the moment. I also though that maybe my experiences where limited to the easy routes set by stronger climbers. That said, I asked climbing partners who are climbing mostly 11s and 12s if the movement was better at those grades and they had very similar complaints. I was kind of surprised I didn't see something like this on this thread before, since nearly everyone I talked to had the "lack of feet" complaint. I do intend this to be constructive though. I'm really excited about the new gym.

Best of luck with the recovery. I had the right knee rebuilt 6 years ago and went through something similar. I ended up climbing reasonably well again after a few months of work.
I'm back off of the rotation again with the left knee ACL replacement a week ago, so in 6 months, I get to get back after it again. Maybe I'll see you around out there after that.
All things heal in time, right?

I don't think the missing feet are limited to the 5.12+ climbing. Even on the 5.6s, my kiddos have a hard time getting past the first hold because of the lack of feet. I've noticed similar thrutchy moves on the (underrated) 10s that go out into the overhang.

I've also noticed that the clipping can be tenuous. The gym is not a place I want to get hurt missing a clip. The crux of "Sleep Debt" is a good example of this.

I am glad that the staff is responding. I did see one of the 9s on the hurricane wall get upped to a 5.10a, which is probably a good thing.

Minimzing footholds helps the setters force the movement they want. But I'd rather see some small chips for shorter folks too.

Bolts seem kind of close together at ET, although given the abrasive walls, I wasn't altogether unhappy about this.

I'll ditto in on the missing feet comment. Great route setting overall, just toss in a few extra feet for people of different heights than the route setter here and there & it would be about as good as gym climbing can get.

This place is great! The route setting is generally really creative, and produces thought provoking routes. The walls may not be that much taller than other Front Range gyms, but it sure feels like it when you're on the wall. Long routes!

I'm a little surprised at how much terrain is vertical or even slightly slabby. I don't climb that hard, but I still want to climb things that are slightly overhanging. The falls are safer, and I come here to get pumped. Some vertical and slabby terrain is always fun, but it seems like Earth Treks has a lot of it. In addition, this terrain is laced with topropes in a density I haven't seen before. It feels like I'm always tangled up in a rope on these walls, and I've generally been avoiding them.

As for the grades, my issue isn't whether they are hard or easy compared to what they "should be". What's bugging me is the range of difficulty that is getting the same grade. I've heard this is less of an issue in the upper grades, but I'm climbing routes that are rated below low 5.11. I've been on 10c's that felt like I expected for a 10c, and others that I would give a full number grade harder. I don't care if the place is sand-bagged, as long as it is somewhat consistent. I don't care what the number is as it relates to anything else. I just want to have some idea of what I'm getting on. A route that is a number grade off is annoying.

It sounds like the gym staff is listening, and I'm sure things will continue to evolve. All of the above are minor gripes (with the exception of the angle of the walls, but that isn't going to change), and I'm still really psyched to have the new gym.

Hey all, it'd be cool to have a Mountain Project night at Earth Treks. I usually climb on there on Thursdays, let me know if anyone is interested in doing this in the new year.

cheers.
-chris

Rob Eison wrote:I had a similar experience with a paucity of feet on 12's and 13's resulting in interrupted flow, thrutchy moves and dynos on the cruxes. And other people have expressed similar impressions at those grades.

I found the same thing throughout the grades from 5.6-5.9. Poor, no, or weirdly placed feet, at least one mandatory dyno on each route (and I'm 6'1"), awkward, thrutchy climbing, poorly located routes relative to the bolt lines, top ropes getting in the way on pretty much everything. The route-setters would do well to take a team-building day and all go climb at Movement once or twice. MUCH better flow on pretty much all the routes at the grades I climb (topped out at about 10b at Movement).

My friends and I have all been loving the route setting. The moves are thoughtful and techy—it feels like a climb earns a grade because it has a hard, interesting move, not just because the holds are smaller. I'm about 5' 10" and have only been on one route (a 5.10a) that *required* a dynamic move.

Our only complaint has been inconsistency in grades between routes. I've been on low 10s that seemed as hard as upper 10s/ low 11s, so there are definitely a few sandbags lying around. Cryptochild's routes in particular are far harder than any others of the same grade.

Overall though, great setting and interesting routes! Absolutely everyone we've talked to in the gym seems to feel the same.

percious wrote:Hey all, it'd be cool to have a Mountain Project night at Earth Treks. I usually climb on there on Thursdays, let me know if anyone is interested in doing this in the new year. cheers. -chris

Hey Chris- I'd do that with ya, for old times sake if nothing else.

I honestly haven't done a ton of gym climbing - I've been to ET more times since it opened than to all gyms combined over probably the last 5 years, so I can't really make good comparisons between gyms for routesetting.

That being said, I have enjoyed the route setting at ET - the routes are generally pretty thought provoking, creative and have good movement. I definitely have not had to dyno to make the moves go on the moderate climbs (5.6 - 5.10) - good thing since I don't think I have a good dyno in me! Some of the moves are a bit reachy for me, but that just forces me to get a little more creative/better with my footwork - one thing I really like about this gym is the walls are actually usable for smearing since they have texture and there is a lot of variety in the styles. In general I'd say the feet are way better than at North Table Mtn (the other Golden gym) - can someone maybe do something about that? ;)

There are a lot of top ropes, but we have just been tying them back out of the way and it hasn't been a problem for leading. It is a gym after all. The gym in general feels way more open than Movement or BRC - and I haven't had anyone clip bolts on the line I am on or pendulum/fall into me while I am leading - both of which I have had every time I've climbed at Movement.