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Extended Rappel Variation

wivanoff · · Northeast, USA · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 674
Michael Urban wrote: Well dude,
How do you know I'm a dude?
[wivanoff looks down] OK. I am a dude.

Michael Urban wrote: you're NOT going to do that - because you'd HAVE a 2nd rope to be doing a Fireman's belay anyway, right?
No, wrong. You ignored my sage advice and did not Google "Fireman's Belay" didn't you?

Michael Urban wrote:I know all about Orthostatic issues if flipped upside down as I an a RN bro!
Then you would also know that you do not have to be flipped upside down to have Orthostatic issues. You could also Google "Suspension trama" and "Harness Hang Syndrome".

OK, OK. I'm just yanking your chain now...
wivanoff · · Northeast, USA · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 674
Stephen Ackley wrote: John, You're correct, I was referring to having a hitch below the ATC and both the hitch and the rapp device off the belay loop. Heres the article
Thanks for that, Stephen. I thought it was a different article about having the backup knot ABOVE the rap device and how climbers/cavers would not release it and it failed all/most of the time.
wivanoff · · Northeast, USA · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 674
John Marsella wrote:I believe that you're confusing FB with "Assisted Rappel" which looks like this: flickr.com/photos/julienaja…
I know that photo is labeled "assisted rappel" but I'm pretty sure that is a "belayed rappel". And I'm pretty sure "assisted rappel" is when a climber shares a rappel device with an injured person, tethered together, and they both rap down together.

Not to pick nits, but look at the confusion mislabeling "fireman's belay" caused.
Anonymous · · Unknown Hometown · Joined unknown · Points: 0
John Marsella wrote: DUDEBRO. PLZ figure out what is going on here. Firemans Belay: One person stands at bottom of rope and holds the end, +/- putting tension on the line. This tension in effect acts as the "brake hand" to the ATC style device. In the event that the rapeller (on the line, above the FB'er) loses hold of his brake hand, the FB'er adds more tension and brakes the system. The first rappeller is not receiving a FB (because there is no one at the bottom yet to tension the rope). This happens on the SAME ROPE. To repeat: There is only one (!) rope involved. (Unless there is a double rope rap happening, but then the ropes are tied end-to-end and acting as one. But really, that might complicate things for this discussion, so forget I said anything about two ropes. These are not the droids you're looking for.) I believe that you're confusing FB with "Belayed Rappel" which looks like this: flickr.com/photos/julienaja…
Ok yeah John I was! LOL! My mistake!
Anonymous · · Unknown Hometown · Joined unknown · Points: 0
wivanoff wrote: How do you know I'm a dude? [wivanoff looks down] OK. I am a dude. No, wrong. You ignored my sage advice and did not Google "Fireman's Belay" didn't you? Then you would also know that you do not have to be flipped upside down to have Orthostatic issues. You could also Google "Suspension trama" and "Harness Hang Syndrome". OK, OK. I'm just yanking your chain now...
LOL! You got spunk! I like you already!

OK I see what you mean! But - what happens if YOU are THE FIRST guy to rap down and no one IS below to FB YOU then?

Signed - Devil's Advocate!
LOL
M Mobley · · Bar Harbor, ME · Joined Mar 2006 · Points: 911

what if the first person raps down with the intent of giving the second a firemans belay and the first guy giving the firemans get smashed in the face with a rock and the second guy with no autoblock passes out from the gory mess down below???

fill in here- ____ ______ ___

Stephen Ackley · · Flagstaff, AZ · Joined Apr 2011 · Points: 642

everyone goes home and considers taking up caving as a hobby

wivanoff · · Northeast, USA · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 674
Michael Urban wrote: LOL! You got spunk! I like you already!
[wivanoff bows] Thank you, thank you.
I've learned some things in my 40 years of trad climbing ;-)

WOW.. this October will be the 40th anniversary of my first lead at the Gunks! I should go back and do Belly Roll again.

Michael Urban wrote:OK I see what you mean! But - what happens if YOU are THE FIRST guy to rap down and no one IS below to FB YOU then? Signed - Devil's Advocate! LOL
Well, somewhere up above....
wivanoff wrote:Having the first person down use an autoblock and then the rest of the party having a fireman's belay is actually faster than everyone using an autoblock - particularly when there are several in the party.....I think only the first person down should use a backup [read: autoblock] when circumstances seem to require it. Once they are down, the rest of the party is far better protected by a "fireman's belay" from below, which will allow the party to lower an unconscious climber down to them."
Anonymous · · Unknown Hometown · Joined unknown · Points: 0
TRmasta wrote:what if the first person raps down with the intent of giving the second a firemans belay and the first guy giving the firemans get smashed in the face with a rock and the second guy with no autoblock passes out from the gory mess down below??? fill in here- ____ ______ ___
Good point! I'll stick to my simple autoblock rigged myself and alos not have to worry about someone below screwing up the FB as well!
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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