Don't buy Petzl Dragonfly half ropes.

John Wilder wrote: Bear in mind that Petzl doesn't actually manufacture their ropes- they're an outsourced product. Cousin apparently did for some amount of time, I've heard recently that they no longer make them- someone else does now. Not sure who. That said, its not so much the problems with the ropes that bother me (although that is disconcerting), its the approach Petzl takes with it. They are overly self-defensive and accusatory toward their customers if anything goes wrong with them. No other manufacturer does this- Sterling, Blue Water, Edelrid, Mammut, New England- i've heard of folks having various problems with all of these lines, and without exception, they have all been taken care of immediately and without question. Every other manufactuerer JUMPS on problems with real concern, especially because ropes are made in 800m (or more) batches and then cut- a problem in one rope could mean a problem in a dozen. Or more. They WANT to know about it and deal with it quickly. They also want their customers to be happy and buy more of their product in the future- and the only way to do that is to use good customer service. I just don't understand why Petzl continues to be all aggro about their ropes. Its weird- I know quite a few folks who work there- they're all great people and work hard and really believe in their kit. I just don't get why when it comes to ropes this sort of thing happens. Making a flawless product that is affordable is no small feat, and having a problem now and then is just a fact of life in the rope business. How you choose to deal with those problems says much more about you as a company than the problems themselves, imho.

I did know that Petzl outsourced the production, but I would hope that such a high profile company like Petzly would do quality control of products someone else is making that they are putting their name on.

I thought they were made by Beal but no matter, their sheaths are just as lame and their durability is highly questionable. I thought everyone already knew this. Petzel everything but their ropes.

Jonhy Q wrote:I thought they were made by Beal but no matter, their sheaths are just as lame and their durability is highly questionable. I thought everyone already knew this. Petzel everything but their ropes.

Really? Petzl everything? Like the New Nomic v. 1.0, the GriGri2 v. 1.0? They once spent the extra time and effort to ensure that every product was solid, often trailing the market in the process. Now, who knows what they're doing? Too many major failures within a few weeks of new product release.

Petzl ropes are made by Cousin in France. Cousin makes ropes for many french brands like Millet, Petzl, and Simond. Probably other brands as well.

The Word wrote:Petzl ropes are made by Cousin in France. Cousin makes ropes for many french brands like Millet, Petzl, and Simond. Probably other brands as well.

Haven't heard bad things about millet. Simond I've heard iffy things about their climbing gear, but the Euros seem to like it. Wonder what went wrong with Petzl's ropes.

Either way sounds like the customer service is a -20

I really like my PMI verglas ropes. Have been using them about a year and the sheath is still great, they handle well, and more importantly they held during a 35 foot whipper (was a 185 foot pitch and I fell at the very top).

I had a Petzl Zephyr. Never again. The sheath didn't hold up well at all, and I had to retire it after about 6 months.

I have a bi-color 70m blue water dominator, double dry, and it has turned out to be a fantastic rope as well. Was twisty for a while, but eventually it evened out and now it's great.

One more thumbs-down for the Petzl Zephyr. And two thumbs up to REI for taking care of it. Here's my experience.

Bought the Zephyr for the incredibly low impact force (something like 7.3 kn) to be the lead rope for scary routes, long run-outs, and roped-solo climbs. So I babied it.

After about two uses (no falls, hangs, or takes) the sheath began to show significant wear. This bothered me, and I thought about taking it back to REI, but also thought how they would only have to destroy it, so decided just to keep an eye on it.

Then about two weeks ago, I'm first up on a route, struggling before the crux, so I know it ain't my day, and there's four others, so I figure give someone else a shot. I make the clip above me, ask my belayer to take, and hop off. Expecting to go a few feet, I'm whizzing through the air wondering what happened and whether I'm comin' home to Elizabeth with the big one.

About 15-20 feet go by. Fortunately, clean air on overhanging rock. So I ask my belayer what happened. She didn't know. No slack in the system. Two other guys confirm it, she had all the slack out before I went.

So I get to thinking, what the heck is the dynamic elongation on this rope? This is nuts. If this were over a buttress or other feature, I'd have been hosed. And I was below the last piece. Scary.

So I decide to return it to REI. And found this thread, and the one on Rockclimbingdotcom, which cinched it. REI took it back with no fuss. They even transferred the 20% coupon used for the Petzl, to order a new rope - the Mammut Super Safe. Seems like a great rope so far. Thanks, REI!

So not sure what happened with the initial wear and the really un-spec'd elongation on that Petzl, but yeah, I'm with you guys. No more Petzl ropes. Can't believe they won't fess up to some clear issues.

REI gets my monthly tithing for sure - but times like this make it so worth it.

dancesatmoonrise wrote:One more thumbs-down for the Petzl Zephyr. And two thumbs up to REI for taking care of it.

Just checked this thread again... so many bad experiences with Petzl ropes. Glad to hear you're okay after a scary leader fall. REI customer service is the best! Petzl could learn a lot from REI on this count...

I spoke with a Petzl rep a few weeks back. I informed him of the masses of people having problems with the Zypher rope. He said he has not heard of a single person having issues with that rope and he mentioned that Petzl would be quick to take the rope back if it was defective. Clearly he was not in the know.

Just saw this thread and wanted to throw in that I briefly owned a pair of 70m Dragonflies which lasted exactly eight pitches of pure ice before both had core shots. Petzl refused to do anything warranty-wise... whoever said something about them being condescending and accusing the customer of being at fault, yeah, that was my experience too.

This isn't the only instance where I've heard of self-destructing Petzl ropes. JUNK! Put me on the list of people who will never buy another.

I think this thread has enough meat to it...forward a link petzl....

Mammut all the way. Good thread guys. Thanks for the info

I have two petzl fuses (60 / 70m) and I'm pretty grateful that I haven't had any of the issues anyone else has. They've actually been fine. A stiff rope, but no sheath or core issues at all.

Knock on wood.

MaxSuffering wrote:Just saw this thread and wanted to throw in that I briefly owned a pair of 70m Dragonflies which lasted exactly eight pitches of pure ice before both had core shots. Petzl refused to do anything warranty-wise... whoever said something about them being condescending and accusing the customer of being at fault, yeah, that was my experience too. This isn't the only instance where I've heard of self-destructing Petzl ropes. JUNK! Put me on the list of people who will never buy another.

I had a pair of dragonflies... one got a core shot on the second use from a no-event rappel... Petzl did offer to do something about it. They gave me a new rope at a "pro deal" which worked out to a whopping 4% off the lowest advertised price... but I figured it was a fluke occurrence, and bought another rope, which got a core shot within 2 trips. Sold them here for 10% of the retail price after cutting a few few feet off the new rope...

I will never buy a petzl rope again, and honestly, I am inclined to not buy their other products as well (switched from Petzl to BD harnesses, etc.) I did own a Petzl Nomad which lasted 1.5 years and was a nice rope, but the dragonfly experience definitely soured me on their quality.

A few years ago (~2011), when I got my first pair of 70 m dragonflies, one of the two got core shot on the first climb out of the wrapper. To be fair, it got snagged while pulling on a multi-pitch climb, and I did some serious yanking and whipping to get it free. Regardless, I'd never had a rope get core shot like that before, and I didn't feel like I'd been that rough on it. I sent it back to Petzl, they agreed that it was core shot and said tough luck, I argued, and they eventually sold me another at wholesale and mailed it my way.

Again, first time out of the wrapper, the new rope immediately got core shot, this time on a 60-70º rappel on a slab, so technically not even fully hanging on the lines. Again, I sent it back to Petzl, they agreed that it was trashed, and again said tough luck. This time, I took a hard line with them, told them they had a dangerous product, needed to own up to it, and told them I'd start spreading the word. They eventually gave in and sent me a new rope on them, but I had to haggle to get them to pay shipping.

At the time, I checked online and couldn't find anybody talking about the problem. I just pulled them out and unwrapped rope number 3 (the first one, to their credit, still seems to be hanging in there, although there are some soft spots that I'm keeping an eye on), and I figured I'd see if people had started speaking up. Glad to see they have.

Don't buy these ropes, and don't let Petzl get away with robbing you of your money. If my experience and the experience of all the other people on this forum are any guide, Dragonflies are, at best, a risky bet. Better off with Beal... or anything, really.

Edelrid is quickly becoming my favorite. A long time climbing buddy of mine saw one of my Edelrids and asked if I just bought it... It is two years old with at least 2 days per week average on it. No dry treatment or anything and it is still holding up immaculately.

I'm on my third or maybe fourth pair Mammut Genesis 8.5's. They've been indestructible---I've felt it prudent to retire each of the previous sets by virtue of time in service and total usage, but honestly, they still looked fine.

The latest set seems to me to kink more easily than the previous ones, but this could be because I am using different devices for rappelling.

FYI, Cousin no longer manufactures Petzl ropes. The new rope line is manufactured by Edelrid. My guess is that we'll see a huge improvement.

rgold wrote:I'm on my third or maybe fourth pair Mammut Genesis 8.5's. They've been indestructible---I've felt it prudent to retire each of the previous sets by virtue of time in service and total usage, but honestly, they still looked fine. The latest set seems to me to kink more easily than the previous ones, but this could be because I am using different devices for rappelling.

I loved my Genesis doubles. They were bombproof all the way. Mammut makes a good rope overall, too. I have a 60m single made by them and I love that, too.

I've nearly only had Mammuts, love them, no issues.
I've owned the Genesis, indestructible!
Second doubles were the Sterling duetos, great ropes as well.
I'm now using the Mammut Phoenix, pleased, starting my second season with them, they wear a bit faster but we'll see how they fare.