metolius offset mastercam question

drop some knowledge on me, I'm wearing a helmet.

I'm trying to decide between a full set of the offset mastercams versus some doubles in various sizes. Goals are trade route walls in yosemite and zion.

would I be better off with a full set, or a set minus largest and biggest sizes with some doubles in the middle, or something else entirely?

I'll have offset nuts, offset micro nuts, and plenty of standard rack as well.

thanks!

Zack S. wrote:drop some knowledge on me, I'm wearing a helmet. I'm trying to decide between a full set of the offset mastercams versus some doubles in various sizes. Goals are trade route walls in yosemite and zion. would I be better off with a full set, or a set minus largest and biggest sizes with some doubles in the middle, or something else entirely? I'll have offset nuts, offset micro nuts, and plenty of standard rack as well. thanks!

You do not need a full set of offset MCs. The sizes above 2/3 are useless for wall climbing IMO. I own a double set from 00/0 through 2/3 and I have never wished I had a larger offset piece. Are you looking to do some wall climbing, or general free climbing? If you are doing free lines, you would be fine with a single set of offsets. If you are doing easier walls (C2), a double set is a good idea. If you are doing harder walls (C3+), a triple set is a good idea. But again, I have never needed anything larger than a 2/3, after that standard cams seem to work fine.

I would say the 3/4 is definitely worth owning. The 2/3 is definitely the best of the bunch (perfect for angle scars). If I were to double any, it would be that one... but really i just always backclean the offsets and get by with a single set just fine. I've done many trade routes in Yosemite and Zion. Get a single set from grey to red, use em, and see how you feel.

I have a full set without any doubles and have used every one (maybe it's just because I have them) and never felt like I needed more of the same sizes. I've never been to Yosemite but have aided in Zion, the Fishers and various other desert climbs and been glad to have the offsets on more than one occasion. -Brian

EDIT: I do not own the largest one.

I would go with offset cams if you're planning on spending some time on wall trade routes in Yosemite. Especially if you're looking to aid. You could probably get away with a bunch of offset nuts if you're mostly planning to free climb though.

Doubling up on regular cams is always good, but whomever you're climbing with in Yosemite should have at least one full set of regular cams which should make your need to double up less significant.

My experience in Zion is pretty limited, so I'll let others give you gear beta for that park.

FWIW, I have both Alien offsets and Metolius offsets. I find the Aliens to be far superior; the single-stem design makes them a lot more flexible which helps in pins scars.

YMMV

I think you are asking whether you should buy a full set of all the metolious offsets or get doubles of some sizes.

I would start with a single set from the 00/0 up the 2/3 (4 cams).
A next step would be to add doubles to the 1/2 and 2/3 sizes as these are the most used but the 0/1 would be good too.

Lastly I would say it depends on the route you do how useful the larger sizes are. For sawed off angle pin scars the larger size can keep you from nailing sometimes. I found them useful on the Shield and surprisingly on serenity crack in the Valley.

Karsten wrote:I think you are asking whether you should buy a full set of all the metolious offsets or get doubles of some sizes.

Good call. I misunderstood the question when I first read it. I agree with others' thoughts that you don't need anything bigger than 2/3 (yellow/orange).

But I would still go with a single-stem design if Totem or FIXE is making those yet, that is. If going with those, I wouldn't get anything larger than grey/red, maybe even yellow/grey.

Karsten wrote:I think you are asking whether you should buy a full set of all the metolious offsets or get doubles of some sizes. I would start with a single set from the 00/0 up the 2/3 (4 cams). A next step would be to add doubles to the 1/2 and 2/3 sizes as these are the most used but the 0/1 would be good too. Lastly I would say it depends on the route you do how useful the larger sizes are. For sawed off angle pin scars the larger size can keep you from nailing sometimes. I found them useful on the Shield and surprisingly on serenity crack in the Valley.

That is how my rack is.
(1) 00/3/4 & C4 .3 (would like to double this up)
(2) 0/1/2/3 & BD C4 .5 - 4

I have been able to climb everything I've wanted (RRG / NRW / JTree)

My metolious cams are tricam and the doubles are mastercams.

For free climbing, I always carry a full set of offsets when I climb in the valley. Even in the bigger sizes, I very often find weird pin scars that take perfect offsets or I would be looking at some uneven lobed placement of a .5 or .75 c4 or something like that (or more likely I would just end up skipping the placement). I carry my blue/yellow and yellow/orange offsets on pretty much every route. I also take a full set of offset nuts, sometimes doubles in gold and blue. Pin scar pro!

Oh, you wanted to know about aiding walls? I dunno...

For Zion I fully recommend a set and a half of the offset master cams. From 00/0 to 2/3 are the sizes you'll want more of. In my experience I feel as if I reach for the purple/blue and blue/yellow the most.

Ezekiel Thornton wrote:My Metolius cams are [TCUs] and the [Quads] are mastercams.

Or something like that.

Thriller wrote:As lost as I could be, here.

Took me a minute, but I think I sorted it. hahah

Marc H wrote:I would go with offset cams if you're planning on spending some time on wall trade routes in Yosemite. Especially if you're looking to aid. You could probably get away with a bunch of offset nuts if you're mostly planning to free climb though. Doubling up on regular cams is always good, but whomever you're climbing with in Yosemite should have at least one full set of regular cams which should make your need to double up less significant. My experience in Zion is pretty limited, so I'll let others give you gear beta for that park. FWIW, I have both Alien offsets and Metolius offsets. I find the Aliens to be far superior; the single-stem design makes them a lot more flexible which helps in pins scars. YMMV

Mastercams are single-stem. I believe you are thinking of the offset TCU's, but those are not what he is purchasing.