Fixe Sum belay device fail video

Fixe has a new belay device similar to a Gri-Gri. Got to love those patent expirations. They have an interesting video showing a failure situation. Anyone who uses this device should know about it. I don't know how to imbed the video but here is the link:

fixehardware.com/sum-self-b…

EDIT to add: For those of you who keep pointing out that the Sum is not new, if you follow the link to the page you will see a big bright red NEW! right next to the picture of the Sum.

That looks like a pretty serious reason to not use that device.

F that! I 2nd Rob Gordon above.

whoa - wtf... I'd NEVER use that thing...

pretty big design flaw! Why didn't they just design it with a bigger biener hole?

youtube.com/watch?v=6jlUlVy…

That looks like it could be fixed easily enough. The fact that a design flaw that dangerous and that easy to trigger got through their testing makes me question the company as a whole.

I try to make it a point to not buy the first iteration of a new gadget from any company.

Early-Adopters are chumps..

Also, even when the video shows the device acting properly, there is a rubber stopper on the bend where the spine meets the basket. Does the manufacturer recommend this? If not, then even the biner that seems to be safe could have this failure occur if the rubber stopper slips. If they do recommend this, they were aware there was a serious problem and instead of fixing it they put what they thought was a band-aid solution on it without much thought.

Either way, someone knew something was wrong, but still gave it the thumbs up.

Lee Smith wrote:Fixe has a new belay device similar to a Gri-Gri. Got to love those patent expirations. They have an interesting video showing a failure situation. Anyone who uses this device should know about it. I don't know how to imbed the video but here is the link: fixehardware.com/sum-self-b…

Nice to see MP keeping up to date! The Sum has been around since at least 2005 and the karabiner warning for 2 years that I know of and possibly longer.

Jim Titt wrote: Nice to see MP keeping up to date! The Sum has been around since at least 2005 and the karabiner warning for 2 years that I know of and possibly longer.

Well Jim, if you followed my link to the Fixe page you too might have been fooled by the big, bright red NEW! right next to the picture of the Sum. And if you have known about it for so long how come YOU didn't bring it up a couple of years ago, hmmmmm?

Eek. I'm curious if the added friction and force of a true fall might right the device?

Hand testing shows the concept, but maybe it doesn't hold true for bigger forces.

Anyone looking to use it could have a dedicated biner with it fixed between two rumps of tape or something, but that really shouldn't be necessary for a finished device.

Lee Smith wrote: Well Jim, if you followed my link to the Fixe page you too might have been fooled by the big, bright red NEW! right next to the picture of the Sum. And if you have known about it for so long how come YOU didn't bring it up a couple of years ago, hmmmmm?

Fwiw, there's lots of old threads about possible issues with the Sum, so I'm not really following why you're being harsh towards Jim about it. And yup, it's far from new. Patented in 2006 and came out around the same time as the Cinch.

Edit- A quick google turned up user reviews for it on RC back in 2006, so yeah, not really new at all in spite of what the Fixe site says.

Edit x2- And here's a page with the 2009 Cautionary Note **FROM FIXE** describing the problem and detailing a change made to address it (look at the date on the PDF). outdoorsafetyinstitute.com/…

Edit x3- Looks like Fixe and Faders merged in 2009, so that really blows a hole in the "new" thing. climbat.com/v_portal/inform…

Brendan Blanchard wrote: Anyone looking to use it could have a dedicated biner with it fixed between two rumps of tape or something, but that really shouldn't be necessary for a finished device.

Per Fixe/Fader's 2009 cautionary note:

"Having learned that the SUM is sometimes being used with karabiners
that could jam the SUM against movement, Fixe is making
a slight modifi cation to the design of the SUM to eliminate
this interaction with future SUM production. Although existing
owners of the SUM might choose to actively manage the position
of the SUM along the karabiner, Fixe strongly encourages such
owners to choose a karabiner with which no such interaction is
possible."

and:

"Features of a karabiner
that are advantageous include a) a thin cross section of the karabiner
tubing, b) a rounded cross section of the karabiner tubing, and
c) a gradual rounded corners of the karabiner as opposed to sharp
corners. Although by no means an exhaustive list, examples of
karabiners which Fixe has found to work well with the SUM,
when used with the belay positioner properly placed and the
gate fully closed, include (gate type is important!):
1) Rocklock Screwgate by Black Diamond
2) William Tri-Act by Petzl
3) William Ball Lock by Petzl"

Looks like they need to:

FIXE it SUM more.

Lee Smith wrote: Well Jim, if you followed my link to the Fixe page you too might have been fooled by the big, bright red NEW! right next to the picture of the Sum. And if you have known about it for so long how come YOU didn't bring it up a couple of years ago, hmmmmm?

I might have been fooled, on the other hand I wasn´t.
I had one to test when they first came out and it was a large, awkward thing with nothing going for it. That Faders had an issue with some karabiners was well publicised some years ago.

I fall on the Sum device every time I climb, and it has never failed to catch my fall. The momentum from the fall is enough to actuate the device, and I would bet 99 times out of 100 that it would actuate without anything on the brake side. I will say that if you grab the climber side of the rope with nothing on the brake side, you can prevent the device from locking, but this holds true with most devices. I love the sum.