C3's, powercams or mastercams???

I was hoping some more experienced trad climbers could give me some input. I currently have a set of 1-4 powercams for my smaller cams. I was looking into either selling the powercams and replacing them with mastercams or C3's and was hoping someone could give me some opinions about smaller pro. I have heard good things about all three but wanting someone else's opinion. So far I haven't ran into many spots that a powercam was too wide for. But I haven't climbed many places other than Smith and some other Oregon crags.

It just comes down to preference and where your climbing. Find someone who has em, use em, and see for yourself.

I agree that a lot of it comes down to where and what you're climbing. Personally I like and use all 3 depending on what I'm doing. My preference is master cams from 2-6 (yellow-green) ultralight TCUs from 00-4 (gray-red) and I carry 000-0 C3s. I like having the versatility of using either the MC or the TCUs in smaller cracks (hence the overlapped sizes) and I take the C3s with me for aiding anything with lots of small scars.

I use aliens, C3s, and mastercams fairly interchangeably. C3s have that narrow head-width which can really work out sometimes, but with all the quality small cams available there isn't really one cam to rule them all anymore. On a price point, I'd opt for mastercams.

Don't limit yourself to just BD or Metolius. Wild Country makes some excellent small cams (the Zeroes), and Trango also has an offering (although not the best).

I use Zeroes almost exclusively, although I keep telling myself to pick up some TCUs or Mastercams.

I use both Mastercams in the smaller range and C3's from 00-2. The sizes are similar but sometimes one fits better than the other depending on the placement... i.e. flaring cracks I'll use the C3 and for a fairly parallel crack I'd use the Mastercam to achieve better surface contact. The Mastercam is considerably longer than the C3 and will not fit nicely into places a C3 would. That's just how I do it.

I love my mastercams from 00-4. They have a more flexible stem than the C3 so they fit odd angled placements a little better. As others have said, the C3's fit scars and shallow crack better.

I bought a set of WC Zeros a few years back and I never found a bomber placement for them (which is the personal preference thing, I just don't SEE the placements for the Zeros like I do Mastercams). I'll probably end up selling them on here before too long.

I also picked up 2 smaller Trango cams and they are pretty nice, just not as smooth as mastercams.

I think I may end up with doubling the small sizes with C3s and Mastercams but I think I'd recommend the Mastercams as your first choice.

Brian Scoggins wrote:Don't limit yourself to just BD or Metolius. Wild Country makes some excellent small cams (the Zeroes), and Trango also has an offering (although not the best). I use Zeroes almost exclusively, although I keep telling myself to pick up some TCUs or Mastercams.

Oh yeah, I forgot my zeroes. They are good cams as well. I have a lot of little gear, apparently.

Thanks so much for the input everyone. looks like I should sell the new powercams (I bought them because there was a killer deal on them a while back)and find some mastercams to start and then buy some C3's to fill in the gaps. For the Wild Country people I would love to buy the zeros if I wasn't a poor college student. Maybe when I get a real job... Anyone want to buy some UL Powercams?:)Thanks for the input. on another note if anyone in Oregon wants a trad partner I am new to trad but still proficient and safe!

Reese Smith wrote:if I wasn't a poor college student.

If you are considering TCUs, I will throw in a vote for Wired Bliss TCUs, which are only $45 a pop - save some coin and support a small company.

Reese-

I wouldnt worry so much about selling new powercams. Honestly, they fit in about 90+ percent of all placements. Yeah, there will be a couple of spots where they wont fit as well, but the reality is that they are going to do great at almost everything you do.

I'd just climb on them more before you start worrying about what they wont fit. I climbed for about 10 years before upgrading to the Mastercam styles. You really dont NEED them. Climb with your powercams till you decide it is necessary to change.

Peter Springs wrote:Climb with your powercams till you decide it is necessary to change.

Especially if you aren't having issues with the head width. If anything, buy a few C3s or masters to double up the powercams.

Wehling wrote:I bought a set of WC Zeros a few years back and I never found a bomber placement for them (which is the personal preference thing, I just don't SEE the placements for the Zeros like I do Mastercams).

And that's really what it came down to. I bought mine before the Mastercam came out, Aliens were impossible to find, or dangerous, and C3s hadn't come out either. I'd never liked using TCUs, so I went with Zeroes. I love 'em, but others might not. Just don't limit yourself to BD (ech!) or Metolius without trying everything else. Who knows, maybe Wehling will cut you a deal, provided I don't beat you to it.

i like my zeros ... the extendible sling sometimes saves me a draw ...

the placements are pretty good with em IMO ... like any small cam though, i dont think you can be truly "bomber" with cams that size

i also have TCUs, have used mastercams, aliens, C3s ..etc ...

my first choice would be aliens if they still made them and if they are reliable .. after that zeros, then mastercams, then C3s, TCUs last ...

It's size dependent. In the smallest sizes, the gray, purple and green C3s have a much narrower head width than anything else. Above that, I like Aliens and TCU's but Mastercams hadn't come out yet when I bought my TCU's. I LOVE the yellow and orange TCUs but have thought more than once that I wanted Mastercams in those sizes. They do fit in just as many places and I like single stem cams. I have a few offset Mastercams and like em a lot.

Reese - been asking myself the same question. Last week my partner took a good unplanned leap onto a well placed (I cleaned it) yellow C3. However, I find the C3's walk pretty easily and can be very hard to extract, part of this is due to the fact they're in small cracks and it's tough to get your fingers in to work them out, but seems they walk far more easily than other small cams. My 2 cents.

JoeP wrote: If you are considering TCUs, I will throw in a vote for Wired Bliss TCUs, which are only $45 a pop - save some coin and support a small company.

One thing to consider when buying Wired Bliss is the long wait to get them and poor customer service. That said, the cams are great and the price is right.

Ok one more questions. Is the #000 #00 c3 and #00 #0 powercam/mastercam worth it for freeclimbing pro? or is the rating too weak for lead falls?

The #000 C3 is for aid only and... I wouldn't fall on that. I have taken falls onto the #00 C3 though. I trust it. I don't know much about the Mastercams in terms of falls though

C3's are nice but the stiff plastic sheath can become disfigured. I have taken a few falls on the green, red, and yellow. After falls on each, the cams held but the sheaths became disfigured. Eventually the sheath disfigurement interrupted the trigger device and the springs would not engage. The C3's are strong cams, they hold, but the stiff plastic sheath is not worthy of BD's craftsmanship!

I really like the metolius mastercams because the sheath is flimsy and they can take a beating. Moreover, I feel secure on mastercams when climbing above them. I have taken falls (horizontal cracks) on my mastercams and the wire sheath has not become disfigured, much better then the C3's. The small blue mastercam is one of my favorite cams and I use it on about every route!

Alien were sweet at one time. I have not bought any of the newer aliens so I cannot comment on their current craftsmanship.

Hope this is helpful!

Reese Smith wrote:Ok one more questions. Is the #000 #00 c3 and #00 #0 powercam/mastercam worth it for freeclimbing pro? or is the rating too weak for lead falls?

#0 MC has held a few of my falls. I would pass on the #000 c3 if you haven't found a need for it on routes, otherwise it will spend a lot of time as a paperweight.