Careers and Climbing the epic question.

Many, most, if not all of us on this forum have the constant burning desire for adventure. Though the scope and extent of these adventures vary for all of us, there is always that one major obstacle. Work. Careers. Money. Though were do you draw the line? When do you take the leap, sell all unessential belongings and take that epic adventure you dream of every day?
Sure, you have to have planned, taken the necessary measures of eliminating debt, have some money saved to fund it, have transportation and food costs worked out beforehand, that's obvious.
I did it two years ago for 3 months with an ex-girlfriend, did the western loop with the exception of Cali, S. Utah, Colorado, Wyoming, South Dakota, Idaho.
I feel like I reached my personal nirvana. I was happy, smiled every morning, every day, and had the most compassion for fellow climbers and people in general that I have ever had. Once you feel it it never really goes away.
Now I am 20 got lucky and landed a helluva job working for a military sub contractor, and climbing the ladder quickly. But for what? For the money? For the respect, for the prestige? I look at it as a means to an end, a way to fund my next epic adventure. But I get pulled both directions, I have the opportunity laid out in front of me to climb up the ladder as high as I want. I only have a two year certificate degree in a little known field but its not limiting me, but it is limiting my climbing career.
I know in my heart I would rather live out of a truck, poor, climbing every day, hiking peaks, and working seasonal jobs, but there is something keeping me here for the moment.
Im not whining about my job by any means, I am grateful to have one right now, I just had the urge to put some thoughts down.

Life is to short. It could all be over tomorrow and the money you made won't matter one bit. Plan for it and take the trip the next chance you get.

The conflict you are feeling seems to be coming from society not from yourself. You already know what you want to do you are just looking for other members of society to say that it is "okay".

Forget what others may think and do whatever it takes to wake up in the morning with a smile on your face.

you can live your life making decisions based upon what your are able to do as a result of the limitations previous decisions have created for you or you can be preemptive and make decisions which will not fence you in and allow for the life you wish to lead. Failure to be mindful of the second option can lead you to daydream about the life you wish you led/have as an escape from the one your currently living.

PS
there is a point of no return

I can't count the number of times I've had this discussion w/ climbing partners around the campfire after a day of climbing. For my part I would have to say that I've done a half-assed job of doing both. lol

I've managed to keep both climbing and career going at the same time, for sure both suffer or perhaps I should say that I'm not excelling at either.
I've managed to continue through academia and get a doctorate of chiropractic medicine and am now living in Boulder once more, I did my undergrad @ CU. So I've managed to live in places where I have climbing close by so that all my free time can be spent pursuing that passion.

I guess that at some point I decided that I would rather have the security and resources that go w/ the job, take a little bit of a hit on the climbing front (as far as ultimate performance level) and be able to have a little of both rather than a bunch of one.
I'd rather be able to only climb 5.12 but have the resources to do it comfortably anywhere in the world.

I'll let you know how it works out. I'm still very much in the process of building my practice since I just started my business a couple of years ago. But hey, I'm living where I'd like to and my practice is centered around providing sports medicine services to the climbing community, so even if I'm not out climbing all the time at least I'm doing something at work that I'm equally psyched on.

Curious to see what other peoples thoughts are on the subject. In the end I suppose it's just life and you have to do what works best for you personally since you've only got one shot at it.
cheers,
BA

Still,I wrestle with this question all too often. While younger, I spent my time playing the dirtbag climber. Lived in my truck for months at a time. Things really changed for me when I began to take long-term considerations into account. While I admire those that have maintained the climbing lifestyle, I want more. I have returned to school, am been married and have a son. I may never get to take another 3 month trip, but someday in the near future I'll be working 10 12hr shifts a month making enough money to play when I can.

If climbing is enough go for it, but you'd better be sure.

I have the answer... TEACH! It is extremely rewarding and so beneficial. Sure it's not high paying but I feel like it wouldn't e such an amazing profession if you did get paid the big bucks. No one would care about the teaching and how well they taught and whether or not the students understood, they would do it for the money.

currently I am a junior in college and when I graduate I am going to be a Math Teacher for High school and I have to say this is going to be there best career choice to have with climbing... I get paid summers off, all school vacations off, holidays off, and weekends off. Also I am done with work by 3 so I can climb after if I choose a school close to climbing (which is inevitable).

I know there are going to be days where I rethink which way my life is going and if I chose the right thing and whether or not I should have just been a climbing bum and traveled my whole life, but in all reality, I don't think my life would have seemed worth it if I didn't teach my passion (math).

I think everyone must wrestle with the question at some point in their life. What you must decide is what place climbing holds in your life. Is there more to life than climbing? It is one's own decision, no one else could make it for you.

That said, would you be disappointed later in life (say, in twenty years) if you found yourself with a two degree and no real work experience? Would you want a family? If not, then go for it. If that life is the life you would want for the rest of your life, then there's no reason not to.

If, however, you see yourself in twenty years regretting that path, and wishing for a family, steady job, money, etc, then you should probably consider working for the time being. Not to say you don't have enough time to enjoy yourself now; two or three years of being a climbing bum probably won't detract from that too much.

I've thought about it, a good deal actually, and I decided I would not want to shortchange myself later in life. For me personally, I see life as more than climbing, with climbing that ever-necessary distraction. I see life as more than climbing. I'm in school for geology right now, hopefully that will be something I can enjoy as a profession (giving me time to climb in the meantime), but it will also be something that will keep me comfortable later on.

I'm not trying to tell you to look at this from society's point of view, by no means. Just decide if climbing is the absolute most important thing for you.

In that regard, I would say look at your life twenty years down the road and decide where you would want to be.

If you see yourself climbing, and only climbing, until the day you die, go for it.

If not, there's still plenty of time to enjoy climbing in the meantime.

you are only 20 years old! if you feel this way now it isn't going to just go away. if you are 35 or 45 maybe you will seriously regret not developing any long term vision in life, but there is plenty of time to work on your career.

my advice would be to live like a monk for a year or two...save up a ton of money and then go for it. much easier to enjoy it if you aren't begging for change everywhere you go.

dirtbag for a while and then ask yourself - do I want to be doing this 10-20 years from now? if not then seriously invest in something and work on it. but c'mon you are only 20...live a little. be realistic about your dreams, but by all means follow them.

Take heart. You have all the time in the world to make up your mind. Some great climbers of the past have made the decision to devote their life to climbing much later in life than you.

Take for example John Salathe who first climbed in his mid-forties.

As a climber who started climbing at 36, I figure I probably started ten years too soon.

Seriously, though, you don't have to make a decision right away. If you did, what would you have to day-dream about at work? Oh...wait...

:)

Balance - look for balance.

I see three main areas of emphasis in my life - family, career, hobby - I seek to balance these three, climbing would be a sub-set of hobby, granted a major portion of hobby, this hobby would also include the other stuff I like doing for personal fulfillment/fun.

Nice drawing Chris.

Its also good to keep in mind that there is a world of difference between your early 20s and your early 30s. At 20, I was interested in little but climbing and thought there was no way in hell I would want to get married or have kids. My plan was basically to be weird uncle Andrew who just back from Yosemite/Antarctica/wherever. That changed pretty drastically over the next 10 years.

The other good thing to keep in mind is that interest compounds. It is probably better to take off now and road trip if you are just going to blow the cash on hookers and blow anyway. If you are disciplined and can sock away some trip money for later and more importantly a bunch of retirement investments, that money will work for you when you take your time off. You'll also probably find yourself much more in need of some time off in 5-10 years than now. Basically working hard early gives you many more options later, especially if you can keep away from the trap of letting your living expenses always catch up to your income(something I am very guilty of).

Alyson Sewell wrote:I have the answer... TEACH! It is extremely rewarding and so beneficial. Sure it's not high paying but I feel like it wouldn't e such an amazing profession if you did get paid the big bucks. No one would care about the teaching and how well they taught and whether or not the students understood, they would do it for the money. currently I am a junior in college and when I graduate I am going to be a Math Teacher for High school and I have to say this is going to be there best career choice to have with climbing... I get paid summers off, all school vacations off, holidays off, and weekends off. Also I am done with work by 3 so I can climb after if I choose a school close to climbing (which is inevitable). I know there are going to be days where I rethink which way my life is going and if I chose the right thing and whether or not I should have just been a climbing bum and traveled my whole life, but in all reality, I don't think my life would have seemed worth it if I didn't teach my passion (math).

Alyson, the real key to this plan is to find friends who climb that also teach. I taught for a few years and found that summers,breaks,etc. can be pretty frustrating if all your climber buddies are stuck working year round!

When I was 22 or so, I looked at the older people I'd grown up around in my little home town in the Sierra foothills. For the most part they were good people and they'd worked hard from early on (my father started working when he was 14 so he could go to high school). They really believed in all that stuff about hard work and the Golden years when they would retire and do what they'd always dreamed about doing, because, hey, nobody ever lay on their death bed and wished they'd worked another day.

Yet, they were getting to that 'golden time' but they were too worn out either physically or psychologically to be able to do what they'd always dreamed of doing for all those years of fucking boring ass toil for somebody else' profits.

You can always make money, man. That's the chicken shit way out to think you gotta have a lot of money to live well. Like Poi Dog says, that tale of the last big chance is a lie.

Take it from someone who is now 58 years old, do what you dream of doing when you're young, cause that's when you got all the juice to do it right. You can always make money, man, but your dreams are your life.

Our plan (hubby and I) is to finish paying of school debt and a little consumer debt later this year. Then my entire income will go into the bank as savings for a down payment on a 4-plex. I will continue to work, save money, and buy more 4-plexes. The end goal is to replace our income with rental income, then rent out our house, get a small RV and do whatever we want! Eventually sell the RV and buy a sailboat to call home. I'm 27, he's 29. I think it's possible to be able to quit work entirely within 12 years, as long as I can keep hubby focused on the goal!

Edit: I forgot to mention that we don't want kids, that makes our life a world different from most people. Climbing is our 'kids.' The American Dream doesn't have to be career, car, spouse, house, kids, etc. Write your own dream!

He who looks outside, dreams...
...He who looks inside, awakes....

-Jung-

Josh Brown wrote: Alyson, the real key to this plan is to find friends who climb that also teach. I taught for a few years and found that summers,breaks,etc. can be pretty frustrating if all your climber buddies are stuck working year round!

Oh definitely! since I go to Plymouth State (5 minutes from Rumney) a lot of the other students that go here ARE in the teaching certification program. Also, there are a lot of the "climbing bums" around who are planning on being like that for a while. Working in the winter on the mountains and climbing all summer. I was lucky, I found something that worked for me.

Thanks to everyone for their comments, after a whole lot of soul searching over the past few weeks I think I have come to the conclusion that I feel in my heart that I was not meant to follow the paradigms, I have been the most depressed I have ever been while working at my current job, inside all day, sitting at a desk most of the time. My mother was the tenth woman to hike the Appalachian Trail from Maine to Georgia, and rode her bike across Canada twice and the US once, My Dad was climbing classic slab lines in LCC in RR's back in the day, and skied on the Freeskiing Circuit back when hotdogging was all the rage. I cant justify the need for security at twenty years old, Im going on the road.

I think this sums it up for me.

I sit staring into the morning sun; I wish to run, to be free. Ponder, wander, diddle daddle not.
Execute Impeccably!
To never fall, hit a wall, stall,
get a dead end job and aquire an overworked, underpaid, fatalistic modern mans drawl.
Our time here is short after all.
We hardly have time to blink if we just sit and think.
Some are content living dreams merely dreaming,
afraid of uncertainty and insecurity, ever vainly seeking notoriety in this society of false propriety
Selling out for corporate lives, searching for wives, houses, homes, dogs and phones.
I would rather live touchy, risky, rocky, rugged adventures, riding the thin line down the fenceline while im still in my prime; of course with copious amounts of wine.
A fine balance.
Vanity and profanity; an unfortunate societal calamity; is it affecting your sanity? its a sick world.
Its as good as you make it!
dont be complacent,latent side effects.
live it, love it, love it! feel it, push it, never stop, never settle
live it how you like it
smile.
a journey on the road in the grit and grime,
its not a crime? Try it some time.
In our society it feels like it sometimes
the "Man" begins to whine.
Too late,
Ive made up my mind.

I like to live my life like i would want to remember it 50 years down the road, like I'm living in a movie. Sometimes your not having much fun while epic adventures are taking place, but its the best feeling in the world when they have been completed. Lately i have been feeling soo incredibly enlightened, unhindered, excited and free. Life is so tangible, you can create your own masterpiece. The human potential for impeccable happiness is there, you just have to work a little bit to seek it out, follow your heart, and smile a hell of a lot...

Nothing but your chalk and shoes, the whole world disappears, you are driven by the drug in your veins, adrenaline, you fall into an inexplicable sense of well being, a cerebral honing of mind and body to the rock. (After my first time free soloing in Eldorado Canyon.)

Voyaging belongs to the seamen,and to the wanderers of the world who cannot, or will not fit in. If you are contemplating a voyage and you have the means, abandon the venture until your fortunes change. Only then will you know what the sea is all about. "I've always wanted to sail to the South Seas but I can't afford it". What these men can't afford is not to go. They are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of security. And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine- and before we know it our lives are gone.

-Sterling Hayden -
'Wanderer'

I think Ill choose heart.

Andrew Gram wrote: That changed pretty drastically over the next 10 years.

Sooner or later we all hope to win the lottery. Having a lovely wife and some crazy fun kids has been that for me. But you can have both career and climbing, depending on where you live and how much you value sleepin in. Seems like there are times of trade-off and that balance photo couldn't be more on.

A wise friend once told me that you have 3 responsibilities in life.
1. Be happy
2. Be a good spouse and parent
3. Find a way to pay for it all

Brilliant rules to live by, sounds like a great set to keep your priorities straight.

I am 25 years old and have been having this conflict since I graduated college (21).

I chose adventure and risk over security. All my friends chose security. Now they envy me for my adventures and experiences and I envy them for their comfortable and secure life and because I still
live at home. I don't regret it because I think that money comes and goes. Sometimes you have it, sometimes you don't. The memories you get from travel, adventure, and risk, TO ME, far outweigh time lost building security and worrying about money.

Now I am at a point where I want security and to live on my own, which will decrease the amount of adventure and travel I will be able to have for a few years. Hopefully it won't.

Like people said before it is a balance. But you can't predict the future. If you live your life for security and retirement, if you get there you will not be surprised by your outcome.

We have the means now to explore any part of the world we want, climbing or no climbing involved. The memories of new places and cultures will stick with you forever.

You have a good paying job? Bite the bullet for a year or two, train, save every penny you make, settle any debts, quit your job and go explore. You will be 22 and have all the energy you want.

Chances are you won't regret the experiences and memories you get.

My $0.02

I'm bringing this thread back from the dead because I am curious how people's lives and experiences have changed 12 years later. Especially OP, who was 20 when this started and should now be 32. How's everyone living?